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FORD
05-08-2011, 03:15 AM
Scottish Election 2011: Scotland to vote on leaving UK after nationalists surge to overall majority
Scotland will vote on leaving the United Kingdom after Alex Salmond’s nationalists swept to victory in elections to the Scottish Parliament.

By James Kirkup, Political Correspondent 7:30AM BST 07 May 2011


The Scottish National Party yesterday won an outright majority, the first party to do so since devolution in 1999.

The victory will allow Mr Salmond to trigger a referendum on Scottish independence during the next five-year parliament, the first formal challenge to the Union of England and Scotland in its 304-year history. In a surprisingly emphatic win, the SNP claimed 65 seats in the 129-seat Holyrood parliament.

Mr Salmond, returned as First Minister, said his party’s success would allow him to call a vote on leaving the UK.

“In this parliament, we shall bring forward a referendum and trust the people with Scotland’s constitutional future,” he said. Before the election, Mr Salmond said a referendum would be held in the second half of the parliament, meaning 2013 at the earliest.

The nationalist surge represented a humiliation for the Labour Party, which had been expected to win in Edinburgh. Iain Gray, the Scottish Labour leader, said he would step down this year, describing his party’s results as “dreadful”.

Conservative ministers admitted privately that Mr Salmond’s strengthened position would raise a long-term problem for David Cameron.

In theory, ministers at Westminster could change the law that created the Scottish Parliament to prevent the SNP holding a referendum. But Mr Cameron signalled he would not try to stop a vote being held.

“I will do anything as British Prime Minister to work with the Scottish First Minister and to treat the Scottish people and the Scottish government with the respect they deserve,” he said. “If they want to hold a referendum, I will campaign to keep our United Kingdom together with every single fibre that I have.” Before the election campaign began, polls gave Labour a comfortable lead over the SNP, whose promise of an independent Scotland had been battered by the financial crisis that effectively bankrupted similar-sized nations including Iceland and Ireland.

In a speech in Scotland last year, Ed Miliband declared that his party’s “fightback has begun,” a claim that was widely mocked yesterday by Conservatives.

The Labour leader said his party had had “a very disappointing election result in Scotland – we need to learn the lessons of that result”.

Even as they revelled in Mr Miliband’s setback, some Conservative ministers were worried about the implications of the SNP victory for the Union.

One Government source said: “This is Ed Miliband’s problem today, but in the long term, it’s something for us to worry about.”

In Wales, Labour emerged as the largest party in the Cardiff assembly, but fell short of claiming a majority with 30 out of 60 seats. The result could see Welsh Labour seeking to form a coalition with another party, potentially the Liberal Democrats.

Link (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/scotland/scottish-politics/8499427/Scottish-Election-2011-Scotland-to-vote-on-leaving-UK-after-nationalists-surge-to-overall-majority.html)

FORD
05-08-2011, 03:16 AM
Sesh, any chance of this actually happening?

sadaist
05-08-2011, 03:32 AM
Hmmm. Would this be similar to a state leaving the union here? (Texas) This is what happens when a government strangles too tightly. People will only take so much before they say fuck you. Whether it's leaving a union like this, or the people in Egypt kicking out their leaders. We are going to see a lot of this during this decade. People are fucking fed up and can't be squeezed any more.

If Scotland goes....will it start a domino effect? Sometimes it just takes 1 to start it all off and do what others have been secretly thinking about.

FORD
05-08-2011, 03:38 AM
Does this mean I should bring back the Cascadia flag?

Seshmeister
05-08-2011, 06:21 AM
Sesh, any chance of this actually happening?

Unlikely but not impossible.

At the moment it's only about 35% in favor but the conservative government in London is imposing huge cuts in public spending. The conservatives are on the whole reviled in Scotland, this election was one of their better results in that they got 12%. If the fighting over money and cuts gets too serious people may just go fuck it we're off. Salmon is a very credible charismatic leader.

Financially at the moment Scotland is subsidized by England but this is evened out by having a decent amount of oil revenue which goes into the central pot. The argument would be that by going independent Scotland could do more to set up her economic policies to suit us specifically like reducing corporate taxation to tempt investment from places like the US and Japan rather than having it imposed from London.

Personally I'm undecided so far but could be persuaded.

sadaist
05-08-2011, 07:52 AM
economic policies to suit us specifically like reducing corporate taxation to tempt investment from places like the US and Japan... .


Funny....people in the US want to raise corporate taxation to drive investment over to you & away from the US.

We raise ours, you lower yours...of course they will move. Then everyone in the US will bitch & whine wondering why our unemployment is so high and why people can't afford to stay in their houses. And we won't be able to cover all of the welfare for the unemployed as we won't have as many businesses here paying taxes.....you know, since we drove them out to start this entire chain of events in the first place.

Seshmeister
05-08-2011, 11:05 AM
There are other advantages to an international company setting up in that you would be operating within Europe so avoiding import tariffs in the same was as if I opened a factory in the US. No(or little) language differences is an added bonus. :)

Dr. Love
05-08-2011, 01:07 PM
Funny....people in the US want to raise corporate taxation to drive investment over to you & away from the US.

We raise ours, you lower yours...of course they will move. Then everyone in the US will bitch & whine wondering why our unemployment is so high and why people can't afford to stay in their houses. And we won't be able to cover all of the welfare for the unemployed as we won't have as many businesses here paying taxes.....you know, since we drove them out to start this entire chain of events in the first place.

Unfortunately, it's already started -- Why just recently, one of our Roth Army moderator positions was exported to Scotland.

The shame!

binnie
05-08-2011, 05:35 PM
It won't happen.

Seshmeister
05-08-2011, 06:12 PM
You might need to apply for a passport to get back in... :)

binnie
05-08-2011, 06:20 PM
I'm probably more English than Scottish if I'm honest, it's all very difficult. My accent is broad Yorkshire, where I've lived most of my life. My family is a mixture of Scottish and Irish. I guess I'm 'British' through and through :D

They say a Yorkshireman is a Scotsman with all the generosity squeezed out, so I supposed there are similarities......

Nitro Express
05-09-2011, 01:47 AM
Funny....people in the US want to raise corporate taxation to drive investment over to you & away from the US.

We raise ours, you lower yours...of course they will move. Then everyone in the US will bitch & whine wondering why our unemployment is so high and why people can't afford to stay in their houses. And we won't be able to cover all of the welfare for the unemployed as we won't have as many businesses here paying taxes.....you know, since we drove them out to start this entire chain of events in the first place.

The big multinational corporations pay no income tax. Exxon-Mobile does not nor does General Electric. It's the smaller less politically connected corporations who pay the tax. To be honest, I think the countries that encourage entreprenuerism will be the big winners. At one time the US did and many smart and talented people imigrated here. Corporations didn't bring in the PC revolution that made all this internet communication possible. It began with hobbyists and then entreprenuerism. The corporations weren't even thinking in that box. The world has plenty of challenges and it seems like these huge corporations just make the problems worse once they buy off enough politicians. They basically are getting rich killing the golden goose. I think they got away with it because everyone was distracted by all the cheap loans and shopping the banks made possible. Now that distraction is gone and people are getting angry. Many interesting things start to happen when enough people get angry. Sometimes it's actually good and other times it's bad.

It wasn't that long ago that California was a hotbed of entreprenueral activity. The place was just boiling with that energy. I can't believe how anti-business it is now and they actually managed to break the sixth largest gross national product in the world. California is the textbook example of how much damage politicians and an over confident public can do to a place in such little time.

Seshmeister
05-14-2011, 06:57 AM
I think there are a few threads in the sports forum you haven't posted that in yet...

ashstralia
05-14-2011, 07:01 AM
hehehehehee:) we gotsta have a beer one day sesh..

together, but in a totally not gay way.