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Yessir... islam; the religion of peace.
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The whole thing is so so fucked up .
You think the world is so full of terrible things that you become insensitive to stuff and the then shit like that happens and you get shocked to the core .
It's a terrible tragedy .fuck your fucking framing -
it's truly fucked vandy.
this bullshit 'religion' should be fucking outlawed...
in other news, the lovely peaceful immigrants in sweden are kicking off too! multiculturalism at it's finest.
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These guys are really not typical in any way of Muslims (it appears that were not acting at the behest of any group).
Put it this way: there are 'Christians' perpetrating horrible crimes in Africa - but no-one would suggest that makes your average US Churchgoer a potential terrorist; Andreas Brevik is white and Norwegian, but no-one would suggest that all white people or Norwegians are potential terrorists. Explaining away people's heinous actions by recourse to some ideology/religion just removes their agency and risks divorcing blame from them.
Acts like this are sickening, and they naturally provoke emotional responses. But we shouldn't confuse 'Islamism' - political Islam, which is concerned with Jihad and foreign policy - with Islam the religion. The Muslim council of Great Britain - and many other Muslim groups - have been very, very vocal in condeming this act: they are as horrified as the rest of us. Identity politics is a weird beast: these guys may have elected to speak for all Muslims as they committed this crime, but it is incredibly clear that no-one elected them to do so!
It is a time for cool heads, not hot ones.The Power Of The Riff Compels MeComment
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The problem this plays right into the hands of all these right wing extreme groups .
They were all ready on the streets the day after the tragedy , it's just more fuel for the fire for either side.
Actually judging by the comments amongst my social circle acts like this stretch even the most neutral and fair minded person to express racist and angry sentiments .fuck your fucking framingComment
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binnie, i admire your stance and clear voice of reason. but the sad fact is that there are disenfranchised young men being indoctrinated into a hardline stance in their adopted countries...
in fact i believe these fine young men in question were born in the uk to strict nigerian christian parents, and converted in their teenage years.
we had a little kerfuffle here last year you may recall, but our cops take no shit and quickly squashed it as you would a cockroach.Comment
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the edl are their own worst enemy.. lagering up and kicking off with the old bill is 'ardly a good look, innit?Comment
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Exactly. Indoctrinated by extremists, not run-of-the-mill Muslims.
My fear is that two extreme cases like this are used as evidence to increase hostility against Muslims more generally, which just adds more grist to the extremists mill and repeats the cycle.
These were two individuals with incredibly warped views on the world. They are not representative of a religion, a race, of anything else.
A generation ago it was the IRA and other dissident Irish groups who bombed Britain, but it would be laughable today to suggest that all Irish Catholics or Protestants had a prediliction to terrorism: once we get to perspective we can begin to see what these events really are, the tragic consequences of extremism.The Power Of The Riff Compels MeComment
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quite right. we've actually had reason to deport some of these 'imam' types who use the cover of the mosque to preach hate and violence.
in a way, i understand what drives the hate. western forces invading foreign lands on false pretexts is something i've never been comfortable with.
probably much like yourself, i've many friends of all colours, creeds, beliefs etc. and politically i'd count myself far more 'left' than many on this board.
unfortunately when these unprecedented incidents happen, it does cast a pall over the group as a whole. whether it's breivik, mcveigh, these goons, whatever.Comment
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Indeed. The British government has been trying to deport several such figures too. The problem is evidence, however, and not contradicting laws around free speech; also, in many case, human rights - extradicting someone to a country where they are a) likely to be tortured; or b) face a trial in which evidence against them has been collected using torture breaks the mandates on human rights. I respect those mandates, but it must be incredibly difficult for governments/intelligence agencies.
I was thinking about what you said about being left-leaning just this morning. It strikes me that a lot of what these two men were preaching in the street - Western wars killing tens of thousands of innocents, women and children, and being illegal - is all part of the rhetoric of the left as much as extreme Islam, and views which I and many of my friends are sympathetic too (the war in Iraq being illegal, for example; and I know many people who think that Blair/Bush should be investigated as war criminals). The problem is how a person jumps from being outraged at their own government to thinking that they have the right to attack it (which we are all horrifed by).The Power Of The Riff Compels MeComment
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It would help if the media showed more stories like this. We probably would be fucked right now if the Muslim community hadn't tipped the authorities. I wonder how many times it's happened without being reported?
"Ya know what they say about angels... An angel is a supernatural being or spirit, usually humanoid in form, found in various religions and mythologies. Plus Roth fan boards..."- ZahZoo April 2013
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"He said he has a simple message for those who might engage in criminal activity: “You have nothing to do with our faith.”"
^^ that's it, right there.Comment
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One bible story that always bothered me since childhood was Abraham being told by God to sacrifice his son. Now that is some twisted shit and the God of Abraham is clearly a jealous psychopath. Also the story of Abraham makes it ok to treat women like property and says a caste system is ok. One group is better than the other group. Most of our modern religious problems stem from the teachings of Abraham. When one group believes they are better than the other in the eyes of God well you can justify all sorts of behavior. I never liked the story of Abraham. As a small kid I saw it was a bad concept and as an adult I see nothing but bad fruit comes of it.No! You can't have the keys to the wine cellar!Comment
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I think the big western war machine which the US is the biggest player wants more terror to keep the excuse of waging nonstop war. The military industrial complex makes money and they have more excuses to grab more power at home and take basic freedoms and rights from the citizens. Handy when the western banking system is on the edge of collapse and you are looking for an excuse to use thuggery to just take things before the confidence in the system completely fails.
The muslims aren't the problem. They are just being played like the rest of us are being played by western bankers. All they do is kick the muslim anthill and then exploit the result.No! You can't have the keys to the wine cellar!Comment
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yeah, bit hypocritical of any faith to declare that theirs is 'the one true one' isn't it?
btw; R.I.P- Lee RigbyComment
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