Ohio teen trying to steal shoes shot by CCW holder

[twonabomber]

Hey man, nice shot!

CCW holder still may be in trouble because the mall has a no carrying policy.

Ohio teen is shot to death trying to steal shoppers' athletic shoes at Dayton Mall, police say

CINCINNATI -- A mall shopper shot and killed a 16-year-old boy who attempted a robbery on the sidewalk outside, possibly in pursuit of a pair of limited-edition athletic shoes, police in southwest Ohio said Monday.

A Miami Township police official said the slain teenager and two other youths went to the Dayton Mall on Saturday morning for a shoe sale. Sgt. Joe Phares told reporters Monday that details were still being investigated, but that the teens apparently got there too late to buy the shoes they wanted. He didn't have any details on the shoes.

Police said the three juveniles from Middletown then approached two men outside and demanded their merchandise. They said one juvenile showed a gun, and one of the adults who had a permit to carry a concealed weapon then fired his own gun. It wasn't clear whether the adults actually had the shoes the youths were seeking.

"This was a random act of, 'I want something that person has, and I'm going to take it from him," Phares told reporters. "It didn't go down the way they thought it would."

Phares said he didn't have details on the kinds of weapons involved, but said investigators told him the juvenile's gun was a real firearm. Two young people have been killed in Ohio in recent months carrying what turned out to be pellet guns.

Police responded Saturday morning to a reported shooting at the Dayton Mall just off Interstate 75 near the southern suburb of Centerville. The Montgomery County coroner's office said the teenager died at 10:55 a.m. Saturday. The coroner Monday identified him as Jawaad Jabbar and said he died of a gunshot to the torso. Police said no one else was injured.

Police said the other two teens were being held in juvenile detention in Dayton. Phares said it's too soon to say what charges could be brought.

Several news media outlets reported that Jabbar was a student and athlete at Middletown High School. A message was left at the school, which was on holiday break. A message was also left Monday at a Jabbar family residence in Middletown.

"It's a terrible thing," Phares said.

The adult shopper's identity wasn't released immediately.

http://www.cleveland.com/nation/index.ssf/2014/12/ohio_mall_shopper_shoots_kills.html

[DONNIEP]

No one deserves to die over a pair of shoes. It doesn't matter that the "alleged" robber had a gun and showed/flashed it at the "victim". The "victim" should have handed over his shit and said "Thank you, and Merry Christmas!". It's just an alleged armed robbery, for JBC's sake! People can't go around shooting "allegedly" armed robbers! Those guys hadn't been tried in a court of law and the citizen had no right to whip out his piece and kill one of them. Those guys were innocent until convicted!

I think it's high time that the citizens of America get with the program - if someone robs you then you turn a blind eye and hand over yo shit. It's only money, after all. And some people don't have as much as you do, so you should think of their needs before yours. Didn't Spock say the good of the few outweighs the good of the many? I think he did. God Bless the alleged robbers.

NO JUSTICE NO PEACE!!!!

[Nitro Express]

Yeah well you know. You take the concealed weapons class and they drill it into your head that you only shoot if it's a life threatening situation. Now what will be argued is exactly what is a life threatening situation? Flashing a weapon. Being an expert in Jujitsu. That's the grey area and it's one a good course roll plays and drills.

[Nitro Express]

Around here they sell bear spray because bears are a problem. It's potent pepper spray. Now if some punk wants to steal your shoes and you don't want to be generous and reward the thief, give them a blast of bear spray. They will wish you had shot them.

[Seshmeister]

No one deserves to die over a pair of shoes. It doesn't matter that the "alleged" robber had a gun and showed/flashed it at the "victim". The "victim" should have handed over his shit and said "Thank you, and Merry Christmas!". It's just an alleged armed robbery, for JBC's sake! People can't go around shooting "allegedly" armed robbers! Those guys hadn't been tried in a court of law and the citizen had no right to whip out his piece and kill one of them. Those guys were innocent until convicted!

I think it's high time that the citizens of America get with the program - if someone robs you then you turn a blind eye and hand over yo shit. It's only money, after all. And some people don't have as much as you do, so you should think of their needs before yours. Didn't Spock say the good of the few outweighs the good of the many? I think he did. God Bless the alleged robbers.

NO JUSTICE NO PEACE!!!!

Thank you, I finally understand the right wing Christian American philosophy.

The teachings of Jesus are sarcastic, he was joking and being ironic.

If you read 'But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also.' in a sarcastic voice with a grin on your face, suddenly 2000 years of killing makes sense.

[DONNIEP]

Thank you, I finally understand the right wing Christian American philosophy.

The teachings of Jesus are sarcastic, he was joking and being ironic.

If you read 'But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also.' in a sarcastic voice with a grin on your face, suddenly 2000 years of killing makes sense.

Exactly. Now you get it. Look, JBC did say to turn the other cheek. And he did say to forgive others for what they do to you. But nowhere in the Bible does it say "Hey, Honkie, let other people rob, rape, beat, and murder you!" That whole "turn the other cheek" thing is a good idea. But you have to use the brain God gave you to figure out when you're taking it too far. And hopefully that will be before you're laying your neck on a stump waiting for some idiot to chop your head off.

[DONNIEP]

And I'm still waiting for you guys to go back to carrying swords and sword fights. The day that happens I am leaving America and it's gonna be on! Damn I always wanted to run around with a sword!

[ZahZoo]

Yeah well you know. You take the concealed weapons class and they drill it into your head that you only shoot if it's a life threatening situation. Now what will be argued is exactly what is a life threatening situation? Flashing a weapon. Being an expert in Jujitsu. That's the grey area and it's one a good course roll plays and drills.

Seems pretty clear cut... person approaches you, demands your property and displays a firearm in any way, shape or form... that's life threatening.

The display of the weapon implies intent to harm if you don't comply... these days it seems more common to harm even if you fully comply. Better off to drop em and then sort things out.

[DONNIEP]

Seems pretty clear cut... person approaches you, demands your property and displays a firearm in any way, shape or form... that's life threatening.

The display of the weapon implies intent to harm if you don't comply... these days it seems more common to harm even if you fully comply. Better off to drop em and then sort things out.

But...but...yeah, there ain't no buts.

I don't know what the fuck has happened in this world where people think that it's ok to commit armed robbery. Now I'm not talking about anybody here, so don't get all bent out of shape. But there's a growing sentiment in this country (and you see it played out on the news networks daily) that the people committing the crimes are the victims. Now, they'll say "Well, little Johnny there wasn't really going to shoot the guy. He was just threatening him." Yeah, and that makes it ok?

Like I said, nobody deserves to die over a pair of shoes. I get it. But this dude was willing to kill some other guy over the same pair of shoes and that's somehow ok in this fucked up society we live in.

If someone pulls a weapon on you, any weapon, and/or decides to start stomping the life out of you, it's not your responsibility to stop and say "Hey, are you gonna kill me or are you just gonna fuck me up real good?" No, you shoot the guy. And you don't just shoot until you think he's dead. You shoot until he thinks he's dead.

Oh well, I'm off to the mall. I'm gonna buy the most expensive pair of sneakers they have and tie the shoe strings together and hang em around my neck and wander through the parking lot. See you on the news.

[ELVIS]

Flashing a weapon...

Without being prepared to use it is a bad idea...

[twonabomber]

Pretty much the same article from yesterday

Teen shot by shopper had demanded new Air Jordan shoes

CINCINNATI (AP) -- Police were studying mall surveillance video Tuesday in their investigation of the fatal shooting of a 16-year-old Ohio boy authorities say tried to rob a shopper in his quest to obtain popular, limited-edition athletic shoes.

Miami Township police said a man with a concealed weapon permit fired his gun after he and another man were accosted Saturday morning by three teens on a sidewalk outside the Dayton Mall. Police said one teen had showed a gun.

Jawaad Jabbar of Middletown died a short time later of a gunshot wound to his torso, authorities said.

Police said the two groups -- the three teens and the two men -- didn't know each other, but had all had gone to the mall south of Dayton for Nike Air Jordan sales offered by multiple stores.

Police Chief Ronald Hess said Tuesday the stores had set up systems to avoid long, tense lines that have led to problems elsewhere when the popular brand has released new versions, and the three Middletown teens apparently missed out.

Police said the teens were outside on a sidewalk when the two men left the mall carrying newly bought shoes.

"They did have the boxes from the stores that were having the limited-edition sales," Hess told The Associated Press on Tuesday. Police said Jabbar displayed a gun and demanded their merchandise, then the man with the concealed weapon permit pulled out his gun and shot him. No one else was injured.

The other two teens remained held in juvenile detention while the investigation continues. Police haven't released the identity of the man who fired the shot, and are still investigating his actions.

"We'll review the whole case with the county prosecutor, and if they determine he violated some law, then yes (he could be charged)," Hess said. There was no estimate on how long the investigation would take, he said.

Jabbar's father, Wallace Jabbar, told The Hamilton-Middletown Journal-News in a brief telephone call Monday evening that he was "obviously devastated" and has been out of town working. The newspaper said Jabbar's mother declined to comment.

Jawaad Jabbar was a student and athlete at Middletown High School, which is on holiday break.

The Nike shoes named for retired basketball superstar Michael Jordan are prized by both athletes and collectors, and entrepreneurs often sell shoes bought for around $200 at double that or more online.

Police in New Jersey and Louisiana reported armed robberies in recent months involving Air Jordans, and a Springfield, Massachusetts, man was sentenced to up to four years in prison for a shooting that wounded an 11-year-old girl waiting in line at an Air Jordan sale in 2013.

News media outlets in the Toledo, Ohio, area reported last week that police used pepper spray to disperse crowds gathered for an Air Jordan shoe sale at Franklin Park Mall.

A spokesman for Nike's Jordan Brand said in a statement Tuesday that it encourages people seeking its products to do so in a "safe and respectful" way.

"Consumer safety is of paramount important to us," Brian Facchini said in response to an AP request for comment. "We continue to work with our retail partners to share best practices and refine our launch process to improve the buying experience for our consumers."

http://www.cleveland.com/nation/index.ssf/2014/12/teen_shot_by_shopper_had_deman.html#incart_river

Some of the comments..."Bless his sole" and "Yep. In fact, they're killer shoes. They're to die for."

[WACF]

Without being prepared to use it is a bad idea...

Someone pulls a weapon on you...you could be fatally wrong if you think for a second they won't use it on you.

This story cold of easily been shopper shot over pair of shoes.

What I have a hard time with is the idea that anyone needs to carry a weapon around.

Frozen hillbilly is where it's at...

[ELVIS]

What I have a hard time with is the idea that anyone needs to carry a weapon around.

It's not a need to keep and bear arms...

It's a right...

[Angel]

Frozen hillbilly is where it's at...

Damn straight...

[Seshmeister]

I'm old enough to find it shocking that people will pay $400 for a pair of Nike shoes...