1978

[Skin_Walker]

I never liked Metal. In England in 1978 it didn't really exist. It was all about The Clash, Stiff Little Fingers, The Stranglers, you get the picture. Then a friend of mine leant me Van Halen 1. I realised this was brilliant music - good time rock and roll fun. This band didn't take themeselves too seriously and had some great tunes.

28 years later I sill play that record and it still sounds good, but where did this music come from? In 1973 Montrose recorded their debut album'Montrose'. What are the common factors in both these records? Sunset Sound? Ted Templeman? Ok Ronnie Montrose is no Eddie VH, but the record has the same feel as VH 1, all single takes, few overdubs and the sound of a band having a good time playing their songs.

After VH1 it was over for me, VH2 sounded like polished up outtakes from VH1. With the possible exception of 1984 VH never released an album as good as the first again.

So what is the VH legacy? Warrant? Poison?
Or is it lawsuits, alcoholism, cancer?

In DLRs book Crazy From THe Heat, there is a photograph of DLR and EVH on stage entitled 'When we were kings' That sums it all up to me.

[DeadOrAlive]

Re: 1978

Originally posted by Skin_Walker
It was all about The Clash, Stiff Little Fingers, The Stranglers, you get the picture.

Take out The Clash, you've got some good stuff there.

But Classic Van Halen had a different feel for all albums, VHII having a very similar one to VH. VHII was more of a party album whereas VH was more of a kick ass rock and roll album.

I dig everything they boys did with Dave. When Dave left, then you should start complaining. Whining about love and why it is or not around.

Nevertheless, VH is a classic and one of a kind record, just like the rest of the six pack if you ask me.

[bueno bob]

Re: 1978

Originally posted by Skin_Walker
So what is the VH legacy? Warrant? Poison?
Or is it lawsuits, alcoholism, cancer?

I'm inclined to think the latter...

Warrant and Poison were more directly influenced by the glam acts of the '70's, I think...Kiss, Alice Cooper, that sort of thing...

Without any doubt, there was no hair metal band in the '80's that came anywhere close to stealing classic Van Halen's fire. The closest ones might have been Motley Crue to a point, but that was more on imagery and less on music aptitude...

[bueno bob]

In regards to the six pack, they're all their own albums and they all speak for themselves. Van Halen II is in some ways a superior album to Van Halen I, in my opinion. Women and Children First, Fair Warning, Diver Down and 1984 all offered growth and expansion on the precepts that made Van Halen I such a monster...I personally think Van Halen's studio sense was growing quite well from album to album. Practice does indeed make perfection. The real crime is that we were robbed of seeing just how great they truly could have been by what amounts to being truly pithy reasons, no matter how you slice it.

[Skin_Walker]

Yeah, but nobody seems to be taking the bait about Montrose. 1973 Montrose is 1978 VH1 and vice versa. In many ways they are the same recird, not the same band definitely but the same record none the less, has anybody actually listened to Montrose here?

[sadaist]

Originally posted by bueno bob


The closest ones might have been Motley Crue to a point, but that was more on imagery and less on music aptitude...

Dead on. The Crue came the closest, and musically that was only the 1st two albums. It was all about image and attitude.

As for Vh 1, I don't even regard that as their best work. Listening to their later albums, I would have to say Fair Warning had the most musical thought put into it. Not the most party or rockin' album, but deep. Listening to "Push Comes To Shove", Eddie's guitar work is nearly Gilmoure or Clapton-esque. Extremely well done.

But my personal favorite is 1984. Maybe due to my age at the time being 13 and just coming of age with my musical tastes and the MTV revolution. Drop Dead Legs & Girl Gone Bad were overlooked by the boys for videos and many concert set-lists but are gems. Panama to this day is still more fresh than any rock song released in the last 20 years.

[Calderone]

Drop Dead Legs & Girl Gone Bad are forgotten.....but that tunes kick some serious ass !
i love those tunes ! ! ! !

[bueno bob]

I have to admit, 1984 is probably my favorite. Diver Down actually comes in a close second, and I'm probably in the minority of people here who will say that...Diver Down has such a relaxed, easy vibe to it, it's a real pleasure for me to listen to over and over. It's a very "summer's here" vibe for me...grate for cruising down the street on a hot August day with the windows down, radio blaring...I do it every year and love it.

[bueno bob]

Most musically thought out is Fair Warning, I agree there...

[bueno bob]

Originally posted by Skin_Walker
Yeah, but nobody seems to be taking the bait about Montrose. 1973 Montrose is 1978 VH1 and vice versa. In many ways they are the same recird, not the same band definitely but the same record none the less, has anybody actually listened to Montrose here?

There are some similarities there, I suppose. I've got old cassette bootlegs somewhere of Van Halen covering Rock Candy, Bad Motor Scooter and Space Station #5, so I'm sure Van Halen brought over a little of that to the studio.

On the same token, though, "Van Halen" is also similar to a lot of other 70's albums in layout and execution...there could be equal contrasts made with Black Sabbath, Deep Purple, Led Zeppelin, Aerosmith, Doobie Brothers and Queen albums just as easily as Montrose's debut...

[BALLYJUNKIE]

i think the reason no ones commenting on montrose .........is cause of thier lead singer ?

[POJO_Risin]

Oh for fuck's sake...

the same vibe as Montrose?

THE SAME VIBE AS FUCKING MONTROSE?

You might as well be calling Classic Van Halen gay...

no way is there the same vibe. Recording the same way...and having the same vibe are two totally different things.

Now as far as their legacy goes...it depends on who you ask...no more...no less. It doesn't fit into EITHER category that you spoke of...

If you ask people that were around during that era...you'll get "Greatest Rock Band of all Time..."

If you ask people in the late 80's and 90's...you'll get a band that is compared to the Extremes of the world...and perhaps as the best Pop Band...but not hte Greatest Band of all Time...

If you ask people in today's world...you'll get...who?

I never worry anymore about what could have been...because I'm a firm believer in reaching a peak...and having to live up to it. In many, many ways...Van Halen of the classic sense spent 4 albums trying to find the SPLASH of VH1...

of course...we all know about the other albums...

but I DO think that Roth and EVH were searching for that commercial success that VH brought them...and by that...I mean...the SPLASH of the bitchslap to the masses.

In the same respect...I think that VH just did their thing...you could see their influences come out on every album...rock...blues...some jazz...old school...new school...weird school...

by the time 1984 came out...they had been down the road and back again...

where as VH1 was raw power in that bitchslap sense...

1984 was 5 albums put into one...the best of it all...and you can hear pieces of all the albums on that one solitary album.

[bueno bob]

Re: 1978

Originally posted by Skin_Walker
With the possible exception of 1984 VH never released an album as good as the first again.

Honestly, you're not the first person I've spoken with over the years that feels that way. I've known more than one or two people who were in their teens or 20's back then who today feel that Van Halen I was their best album ever and everything released thereafter failed to reach it's benchmark.

On that aspect, all I can really say is "To Each His Own". Again, I have to say that, to my mind, Van Halen improved from album to album (well, classic Van Halen, anyway) - to my mind, "Van Halen" has never really flowed right...nitpicking really, but I always thought RWTD was a very weak way to start the album, always thought On Fire or maybe Let's Get Rockin' would have been far better choices for a lead off track...Eruption didn't need to be the 2nd track and should have been relegated to side 2 somewhere, and YRGM should have ended side 1...but, you know, I could nitpick forever and it gets me nowhere, and at the end of the day, who the hell cares, anyway? Track order doesn't detract from the album's overall quality, which is 9.5 out of a possible 10.

But I can understand where you're coming from on the "lesser quality per album" issue, I've spoken to quite a few people who were there that thought everything after the debut was a little worse than what came before it.

No arguing taste, though.

[Nickdfresh]

Yeah, it was exactly the same vibe as Montrose, only Van Halen didn't fall apart never to be heard from again. *snicker*

When I hear "Jamie's Cryin'" blasting from a live boot, all I can do is gently reminisce about "Rad Motor Scooter."

[light 'em up!]

Re: 1978

1978-1981 were the years when VH ruled the world. They were simply untouchable during that time.

1982-1985 were mediocre years by CVH standards... Diver Down and 1984 had some flashes of VH brilliance, but 1978-1981 were the years that VH reigned supreme in my book.

Diamond Dave went on to do some interesting things after leaving VH, although none of that ever came close to what he acheived with Ed, Al, and Mike.

Sammy Hagar VH era doesn't even count.