View Poll Results: Can you just shoot anyone who is in your house uninvited?

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  • Hell ya! I can shoot someone to protect my family even if there was no direct threat.

    2 16.67%
  • No! If no one is directly threatening you, you can't just murder them!

    6 50.00%
  • It's a tragedy, and we'll never really know the exact circumstances...

    4 33.33%
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Thread: Popular Teacher Fatally Shot After Entering Wrong House

  1. #1
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    Popular Teacher Fatally Shot After Entering Wrong House

    It's kind of a big local issue here where apparently a popular Albany, NY area teacher was in town with his wife to celebrate the birth of their friends' child. He mistakenly entered the wrong house and the homeowner immediately opened fire killing him. The man was a 31-year old award winning teacher and it appears to be a big tragedy. Some say the homeowner is a psychopath that should have given "fair warning" before blasting this poor guy--and should be charged with at least manslaughter as there was no direct threat to him or his family.

    Others say "too-bad," and that you're taking your life into your own hands when you startle armed people in their own homes. Not sure what I think personally, but I believe that someone at least deserves a shout of "get the fuck down or I'll fucking shoot you!" before you blast them. Related story below:

    -NDF


    Police believe door was unlocked at site of teacher's death
    Homeowner's lawyer says Park entered rear, walked into kitchen, 2 rooms before slaying

    By Dan Herbeck
    Buffalo News Staff Reporter
    Updated: April 01, 2010, 12:10 am /
    Published: April 01, 2010, 6:55 am


    David Park was shot after mistakenly entering the wrong house during a party

    Investigators believe David W. Park walked through an unlocked rear door when he entered an Amherst home where the resident shot and killed him, sources close to the case told The Buffalo News.

    The rear door led from a raised deck into the home on Millbrook Court where Park was shot as an intruder early Sunday.

    Police who responded to the home soon after the shooting found no indication of a forced entry.

    Park was not shot immediately after entering the home, said Thomas H. Burton, attorney for David D'Amico, the homeowner who shot Park.

    "The rear door where he entered was on the other side of the house from the location where he was shot," Burton said. "[Park] walked through the kitchen and two other rooms before ending up at the location where he was shot."

    Police believe Park entered the D'Amico's backyard by opening a gate, which he closed behind him, sources said. He then went up onto the deck and stepped inside the home.

    The question of whether the door was locked had been a tightly guarded secret until Wednesday, when three sources familiar with the case confirmed for The News that it had been left unlocked.

    D'Amico routinely locked all of his doors at night and has told Amherst police that he was unaware that his rear door had been left unlocked that night, the sources said.

    Amherst police and the Erie County district attorney's office are investigating the death of Park, 31, an award-winning Albany school teacher who was in town to attend a party at a home next door to D'Amico's.

    So far, no charges have been filed against D'Amico. His attorney hopes no charges ever will be filed.

    "Whether a door was locked or not is not an issue under the law," Burton said. "An unlocked door does not give someone a defense to commit a burglary. The narrow focus of the law is on what was in the mind of the man who fired the shot.

    "No matter how [Park] got in, I can tell you this much for certain — he was not invited in. He was an intruder."

    A memorial service for Park will be held today in his hometown of Old Forge. A second memorial service will be held on Friday in Albany, where he was a beloved elementary school teacher.

    Assistant Police Chief Timothy M. Green, spokesman for the Amherst police, declined to confirm or deny The News's information on the unlocked door.

    "As we've said since this happened, this was a tragedy," Green said. "I don't know why [Park] was in that house, but he should not have been. We haven't found any evidence indicating that he was legally in the house."

    D'Amico fired his hunting shotgun because Park did not comply with his demand that he leave the house and because he feared that Park was about to walk upstairs to where the D'Amicos had been sleeping, Burton said.

    Park is believed to have gone into D'Amico's house by mistake after leaving the party next door. "The reason why he went into [D'Amico's] house is a mystery we may never know the answer to," Green said.

    The Erie County medical examiner's office is conducting toxicology tests to determine if Park was intoxicated at the time.

    Both D'Amico and his wife, Julie, have been "emotionally devastated" by what happened, according to Burton.

    "There are winners and losers in life," Green said. "But any way you look at this case, the outcome is bad for everyone involved."

    dherbeck@buffnews.com

  2. #2
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    I might add that Amherst, NY has one of the lowest national crime rates of any metro/suburban area of the United States...

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    Well, I don't suppose we'll ever know if any words or warnings were exhanged before shots were fired will we?

    But it seems very suspicious to me thatt shooting would be someone's first reation - I mean, I'm guessing that this guy doesn't sit in the house with his gun or guns beside him. The teacher didn't just pop into his eyesight and then 'bang, bang'. He must have heard the 'intruder' and gone to fetch his gun, before shooting him. That to me is almost premeditation - 'I'm not going to find out why he's here, I'm just going to kill him.' But, like I said, I guess we'll never know the details.
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    Option #4

    Intruding is a threat...

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    So you don't think that it's a tragedy that this guy mistakenly entered a house believing it to be his friends and is now dead?

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    Sure I do...

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    But the shooter was perfectly within his rights to fire first and ask questions later?

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    Hw was perfectly within his rights to defend himself and his family...

    We don't know what was or what was not said...



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    I agree - as I said above, we'll never know what happened or not.

    But it seems odd to me that you can shoot and kill someone if you THINK that they might be a threat, rather than them actually posing a threat. It seems a little illogical to me. Say I'm walking down the street and some guy gives me a strange look - he might be about to attack me, so I better kick his head in first, right?

    It just seems a very odd scenario to me - surely pointing a gun at someone would be enough to get them off your property, rather than atually having to resort to shooting them.

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    This same thing happened last year to someone I knew

    Music & nightlife | Seattle sound engineer fatally shot as he tried to enter wrong motel room | Seattle Times Newspaper

    And the guy jumped bail instead of facing a jury, the fucking pussy.

    Big tough gun nut, huh?

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    Jesus, that's just horrific......

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    Quote Originally Posted by ELVIS View Post
    Hw was perfectly within his rights to defend himself and his family...

    We don't know what was or what was not said...


    "Defend" doesnt mean shoot to kill.


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    Well regarding the teacher, we really do not know what happened. Sure, it's easy & it suits well with everybody else to always defend the victim, but we do not know what happened.

    I'm not defending the shooter either. In fact, I believe that anyone that takes sides in this is incredibly stupid and/or retard. Because all you have is what you can envision in your own mind, so you're effectively judging someone based n your own hallucinations.

    The case that Lounge brought to the table is a bit different...

    1) It's much, MUCH easier to enter a wrong motel room than a wrong house.

    2) Who the hell leaves his door unlocked while staying at a motel/hotel/whatever?

    3) At any given time, staff with keys may & will enter your room, if it's the place's policy to clean at certain hours of the day, or whatever the fuck.

    4) It's not exactly your fucking property you're defending.

    5) SHUT THE FUCK UP, SUCKADICKI!

    6) We still don't know what happened, but I believe the above points to be highly valid.

    Cheers! :bottle:

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    Quote Originally Posted by ELVIS View Post
    Hw was perfectly within his rights to defend himself and his family...
    Wrong.

    Deadly force is only justified when one's life is threatened.

    Simple breaking and entering is not grounds for use of deadly force, except if this teacher came after the homeowner with a knife, gun, or other weapon...which I doubt happened.

    Just the fact that this teacher was in his house is not grounds to blast him.

    At least that's what we were taught.

    Charge the homeowner with manslaughter at the minimum.



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    All right, who hacked Brian's account this time?
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    A stranger in my house, especially when I and/or my family are sleeping is a very real potential threat on our lives...

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    Quote Originally Posted by ELVIS View Post
    A stranger in my house, especially when I and/or my family are sleeping is a very real potential threat on our lives...
    Go ahead and shoot then.

    Your family needs to be prepared to do without you for a number of years though. You're going to the pokey if he didn't directly threaten anyone. If he was just stealing....game over...for you.

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    So, I protected my family...

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    Quote Originally Posted by ELVIS View Post
    So, I protected my family...
    How? Is the intruder assaulting anyone? If so, yes.

    If not, you can't shoot.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ELVIS View Post
    A stranger in my house, especially when I and/or my family are sleeping is a very real potential threat on our lives...
    Exactly.

    potential

    When it becomes a real threat, then you're justified.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ELVIS View Post
    A stranger in my house, especially when I and/or my family are sleeping is a very real potential threat on our lives...
    "Potential?" Well, if a guy looks at me funny walking down the street in front of my digs, he might be a "potential threat" too...

    In any case, even to most of the worst case scenarios, very few intruders/burglars want to deal with a homeowner and will run if confronted or even if THEY hear something...

  23. #23
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    Lounge's post about the guy in the motel, he needs to be charged with manslaughter, period.

    The teacher's case is definitely one where the homeowner acted or reacted carelessly. Yes, if someone is in your house at night, uninvited there is cause for alarm but at the very least the homeowner should of warned the intruder first. Without knowing the whole story I can't imagine the teacher walking into the guy's bedroom or that the guy didn't have enough time to realize that someone was in his house and get his gun. So he had ample time to warn him while still making sure he was safe. He could of hid around a corner and pointed just the gun at the teacher and warned him at a minimum.

    It's not a Carte Blanche to kill someone just because they trespass on your property. When owing a deadly weapon there comes a huge responsibility for ownership.

    In both cases here the gun owners were in the wrong.
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    I like how everyone keeps hallucinating & judges either the victim or the shooter based on that.

    Cheers! :bottle:

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    Quote Originally Posted by kwame k View Post
    So he had ample time to warn him while still making sure he was safe. He could of hid around a corner and pointed just the gun at the teacher and warned him at a minimum.
    LMAO!



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    Just blast away, E?

    Using deadly force without any responsibility.........

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    I wouldn't just "blast away" but i'm willing to bet no teachers will be wondering into this mans house anymore...



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    A few years ago, I was standing in my kitchen cooking dinner, half naked (it was the middle of the summer) when this kid just walks in my back door. No knock, or anything just opens the door and walked in.

    He looked more shocked to see me than I was to see him. Turned out he was the brother of the guy who lived next door, so just a mistake, no criminal intent.

    The kid actually said "Damn, if I would have done this back home, I probably would have gotten shot!" At the time, I thought he was exaggerating, but it seems like a more common problem than I would have thought.

    Had he actually been an intruder with the intent to commit a crime, I already had a sharp knife in my hand, so a gun wouldn't have been necessary anyway.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ELVIS View Post
    I wouldn't just "blast away" but i'm willing to bet no teachers will be wondering into this mans house anymore...




    That'll be a comfort to Park's family.

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    My skeptical mind wonders if the 31 year old "award winning teacher" (as if that makes a difference) was there to have sex with the man's daughter and was cut off at the pass, so to speak...



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    Quote Originally Posted by ELVIS View Post
    My skeptical mind wonders if the 31 year old "award winning teacher" (as if that makes a difference) was there to have sex with the man's daughter and was cut off at the pass, so to speak...


    Is your skeptical mind back on Oxycontin? :confused:

    If Park broke into the house to rape the man's daughter, then the shooter would have said so, because THAT would have provided a valid reason to shoot him.

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    Would it? and did I say rape ??

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    I also like how Elvis hallucination is the one that makes most sense.

    At least, there's a motive, so to speak.

    Cheers! :bottle:

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    I can't believe I'm saying this, but I'm not sure the guy should be charged. The bottom line is, if I saw someone other than someone I know in our home, I would probably immediately treat it as a threat. Now mind you, I live in Chicago. But seriously...I can't say the guy had criminal intent in shooting him. It wasn't like, "Oh, you're in my home? Now I have a chance to shoot you and get away with it!" I'm sure he felt threatened, and probably the majority of times someone enters someone else's home without permission or knocking on the door, it's not innocent.

    I do think it's tragic. But if you saw some stranger walking through your house, how would you feel?

    Mind you, maybe shooting without asking any questions is the problem. Maybe that's where the "gun nut" mentality kicked in. Me? I would have aimed the gun at El Strango and said, "What the fuck are you doing here?" And he probably would have said, "Shit! I must have the wrong house!" And I would have had El Strango put his hands against the wall while aiming the gun at him and then...called the police. Shooting without asking questions only really makes sense if the person is running at you, etc.

    Shit...I've changed my mind in one post! Why just shoot without asking or saying anything? What if it were a cop with a warrant? It could have been anything.
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    A couple of things bother me about this story. First, who in the hell wouldn't comply when someone has a shotgun pointed at you......
    D'Amico fired his hunting shotgun because Park did not comply with his demand that he leave the house and because he feared that Park was about to walk upstairs to where the D'Amicos had been sleeping, Burton said.
    Second thing is......if Park was in the wrong house and there was a party going on in the "right" house, wouldn't he find it weird that no lights were on and nobody was up.
    Last edited by kwame k; 04-01-2010 at 01:20 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ELVIS View Post
    Would it? and did I say rape ??
    If it was consensual sex, then that would make the shooting a murder. Of course this whole scenario is pointless speculation, since nothing in the above article says the homeowner had any children. Only the man and his wife are mentioned as being in the house at the time.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kwame k View Post
    A couple of things bother me about this story. First, who in the hell wouldn't comply when someone has a shotgun pointed at you......

    Second thing is......if Park was in the wrong house and there was a party going on in the "right" house, wouldn't he find it weird that no lights were on and nobody was up.
    That's why I keep saying that commenting about this is one thing, but judging one or the other is painfully retarded.

    Remember - EVERYTHING that is going through your mind & every conclusion you arrive to are simply hallucinations.

    SOMETHING happened.

    Cheers! :bottle:

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rikk View Post

    But if you saw some stranger walking through your house, how would you feel?
    Afraid and like shooting first and asking questions later...

    Not that that's how I would react, but I would be tempted to do just that...



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    Quote Originally Posted by FORD View Post
    If it was consensual sex, then that would make the shooting a murder. Of course this whole scenario is pointless speculation, since nothing in the above article says the homeowner had any children. Only the man and his wife are mentioned as being in the house at the time.
    Ok, his wife...

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    But it does say they were sleeping...

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