THE PITTSBURGH Sports CHATTER

[Va Beach VH Fan]

Meh....

I never thought Pitt was as good during the times when people thought they were among the top teams in the country....

[chefcraig]

You can only imagine how I feel about the guy, after he drove the Dolphins into the ground.

[POJO_Risin]

Wannstedt out after six seasons as Pitt coach

By ALAN ROBINSON The Associated Press
Tuesday, December 7, 2010; 4:48 PM

PITTSBURGH -- Dave Wannstedt is out as Pitt football coach following a disappointing season in which the Panthers were big favorites to win a weak Big East Conference, only to finish 7-5 and qualify for a minor bowl.

Pitt called a 5:30 p.m. EST news conference to announce that the former Bears and Dolphins coach was stepping down, under pressure from athletic director Steve Pederson. Wannstedt, highly respected by Pitt's administration, is expected to stay with the school in a non-coaching position.

Wannstedt's six-season tenure was marked by upset losses to teams such as Ohio University and Bowling Green and a failure to play in a BCS bowl.

Imagine if the Steelers chose this fuck instead of Cowher all those years ago...

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/07294/827301-66.stm

[BigBadBrian]

Not to mention the hit that Heath Miller took.... Jesus Christ, that was bad....

Personally, I thought that was a good fair hit.

[SilvioDante]

Personally, I thought that was a good fair hit.

I believe it was a legal hit also. It was just as legal as Harrison's on Massaquoi that he was fined $75,000 for....

[Bob_R]

Personally, I thought that was a good fair hit.

Nah. It was the poster video/hit for what they're trying to stop.

If that's not fined just don't fine anyone.

Just my .02 cents.

[Unchainme]

A question to be asked

on a steelers board I frequent, the fans there keep insisting that the Browns rivalry is dead and buried and that the Ravens is the new permanent number 1 rivalry.

Can I call bullshit on that? I've been to Baltimore and the sorrounding areas several times, and it's not a sports sort of area by any means. Quite the opposite, I got the impression that most of the people had like this.."I was a band geek in high school and after the game on sunday me and the wife go antiquing" vibe. And when I'm in Pittsburgh and my hometown? I get a vibe of true fans who are loyal and love their team, and love the game of football from High School on up.

So my question is, do you guys feel that the true rivalry is with the Browns or the Rats?

[chefcraig]

So my question is, do you guys feel that the true rivalry is with the Browns or the Rats?

That's an interesting question. To an an old school outsider like me, the Raven/Steelers rivalry would not even exist if Art Modell hadn't moved the Browns to Baltimore, thus establishing the Ravens/Steelers feud. So the move could be seen as an extension of the Browns/Steelers deal, although altered by geography. The thing is, no true Browns fan could in good conscience support the Ravens. Furthermore, it's hard to call the Ravens/Steelers deal a true rivalry, simply because there isn't any foundation of history behind it (other than the imagined continuation of the Browns during the period they were absent from the league). This is further compounded by the idea that the Ravens themselves were mere replacements for the beloved Colts, whose owner pulled a Modell-like move himself in leaving town in the middle of the night.

No matter how you look at it, the true legacies and fan bases of the Browns, Ravens and even the Colts are huge, messed up deals, so attempting to pinpoint just where one begins and the next one ends seems to be an exercise in abject futility. Like I said, I'm speaking as an outsider, yet I can not begin to imagine what a local football fan feels about the subject.

[Va Beach VH Fan]

Well, as is said often when discussing rivalries, for a rivalry to be an actual one, both teams have to win fairly equally....

The Browns have sucked since they came back to life, so it's not up to the level it used to be....

The Ravens and Steelers have been close to equal for several years now, so it's closer to a rivalry nowadays than the Browns...

[Unchainme]

Well, as is said often when discussing rivalries, for a rivalry to be an actual one, both teams have to win fairly equally....

The Browns have sucked since they came back to life, so it's not up to the level it used to be....

The Ravens and Steelers have been close to equal for several years now, so it's closer to a rivalry nowadays than the Browns...

Yeah, but be real, it's not the same or as good as the Browns/Steeler rivalry was back in the day.

Again, I get the feeling that the Browns are a sleeping giant at the moment, and the Rat fanbase is very much the paper tiger. I believe the main reason the Colts moved in the 1980's was due in part to the fans in the STD Capital of the Word not giving a shit, this even during the the late 70's when the Bert Jones led Colts were a consistent playoff team, they struggled to sell out.

[Va Beach VH Fan]

Yeah, but be real, it's not the same or as good as the Browns/Steeler rivalry was back in the day.

Again, I get the feeling that the Browns are a sleeping giant at the moment, and the Rat fanbase is very much the paper tiger. I believe the main reason the Colts moved in the 1980's was due in part to the fans in the STD Capital of the Word not giving a shit, this even during the the late 70's when the Bert Jones led Colts were a consistent playoff team, they struggled to sell out.

The rivalry in the '70's was dirtier, you could get away with much more back in those days....

The rivalry with the Ravens is just as much hard hitting, but it will never match the things such as the Turkey Jones hit on Bradshaw, not to mention the fights in the stands between the fans....

Good Wiki article on it.... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Browns%...eelers_rivalry

[POJO_Risin]

The rivalry between Pittsburgh and Cleveland is always there...and always will be. It's a rivalry between similar cities, with similar backgrounds. It's like having a step brother that you can't stand. They may move away, but they are always the bane of your existence come holidays, or in this case....when they play each other. I'll never forget seeing the Pirates play the Indians in Cleveland. As a devout Indians fan, above all other sports, I didn't feel a rivalry with the Pirates for any reason. I hadn't lived in Cleveland for awhile, and had spent some time in Erie, which at best, is a mix of Browns/Pittsburgh/Buffalo...so you lose the tenacity for the hate. Anyways, I was sitting in the club seats in right field...when a guy with a Pirates shirt sat in front of me. We struck up a conversation before the game...he was from Pittsburgh...following the Pirates (yeah...believe that). Anyways, a quartet of drunk Tribe fans behind me got more and more irritated at the shirt...and his retro-70's pie-hat style Pirates cap. It didn't end pretty...and after beers spilt over Pittsburgh boy...the Tribe fans were escorted out...as was the Pirates guy. Anyways....an inning goes by, and Tribe fans were escorted right back. I asked them what happened, and they said, "The ushers took us to the bathroom and told us to wait an inning until we got rid of the Pittsburgh scum." I asked them what was wrong with the Pirates, and they all unanimously said..."nothing, other than the Pittsburgh on the front of their jerseys." I don't even think they had Pittsburgh on the front of their jerseys...but you get the point.

The better term for Steelers fans and the Cleveland rivalry is that it's dormant. I grew up in Cleveland, and my family were season ticket holders for the Browns until they moved...so I've actually seen more Browns-Steelers games in Cleveland, than in Pittsburgh. If you've ever been to a game in either place, you know that the rivalry is still there...it's just...different.

In Pittsburgh, the Cleveland game is always a worry because of the former rivalry, but not much more than that. It's not a game that we sit around thinking about any more...the way it was in the past. Pittsburgh hates Cleveland...Cleveland hates Pittsburgh. That's just the way it is.

Now...the rivalry with Baltimore is strictly an "on the field" rivalry. I could give two shits about the city of Baltimore. As a Cleveland-born...I fucking hate the shit out of them for stealing the hometown football team (and thus...robbing the Steelers of their moron cousins)...but as a Steelers fan, I could give a shit less about all that. Let me put it this way...in 2000, Rod Woodson, a former Steeler, said that the Ravens D of the time was the best in the history of football. Then...they win the Super Bowl. They are a defense-minded team, with blustery, big-mouth players...set in the mold of the old Steelers. Hell...if you look at the two teams, the reflect each other in the mirror.

So the on-the-field rivalry is bigger in Baltimore now...and was in Cincy as well...and I'd say New England fits in their too, although since they beat us like bitches...we're more like Cleveland in that rivalry.

You see...the Browns really have nothing to hang their hat on now except for four games a year...with the traitorish Ravens, and the Steelers.

100 years from now...there likely won't be a Ravens Steelers rivalry...but Cleveland and Pittsburgh goes much beyond the football field, and always will...cheap hits...wins on the field...dominance on one side or the other notwithstanding...

[Unchainme]

I've heard countless stories about Steelers fans getting a "warm welcome" from Browns fans at the old stadium, from getting beer dumped on them, to having their jersey forcibally taken off and lit on fire, to them getting their ass beaten and thrown into the piss troths.

yeah, unfortunately some of the ushers there have become brown shirts and get pissed when you say something to them now, though from what I read quite a few steelers fans still dislike going there.

[POJO_Risin]

I've heard countless stories about Steelers fans getting a "warm welcome" from Browns fans at the old stadium, from getting beer dumped on them, to having their jersey forcibally taken off and lit on fire, to them getting their ass beaten and thrown into the piss troths.

yeah, unfortunately some of the ushers there have become brown shirts and get pissed when you say something to them now, though from what I read quite a few steelers fans still dislike going there.

My Dad and I went to a game in 1984, and I always wore my Steelers gear, but always kept my mouth shut...and was usually left alone with regards to the physicality...although I had to deal with the cat calls every year. Such is life. Anyways, there was a group of Steelers fans a few rows in front of us...fully decked out...and loud as fuck. In the second quarter of a tough, rather boring game to start...Sam Washington, in his first season as a starter, picked off a pass...I think from Paul McDonald...and returned it for an 80 or so yard pick 6...

This guy in front starts going apeshit...swinging his terrible towel. The Steelers go to the half with the 7-0 lead, and this guy never stopped. Our seats were in 332...great seats...and far away from the Dog Pound...but this fuck stood out. Anyways...five minutes into halftime...a group of Browns fans come down...don't say a word...had to be 40 of them...no shit...lift this guy up...and take him away. He never came back. The group he was with never moved, and to my knowledge, never looked for him. I was scared shitless for the first time in my life...

Steelers fans are ruthless as well...but nothing like die-hard browns fans. I've been to 15 or so Steelers games in Cleveland, and four in Pittsburgh, and I never saw the complete idiocy in Pittsburgh that I did in Cleveland. I'm not saying one's worse than the other...but there's an almost...I don't know..."The Browns are beneath us" take in Pittsburgh...if that fits...

[chefcraig]

Steelers fans are ruthless as well...but nothing like die-hard browns fans. I've been to 15 or so Steelers games in Cleveland, and four in Pittsburgh, and I never saw the complete idiocy in Pittsburgh that I did in Cleveland. I'm not saying one's worse than the other...but there's an almost...I don't know..."The Browns are beneath us" take in Pittsburgh...if that fits...

Over the years while attending Dolphins games, I too have seen my share of moronic, mouth-breathing behavior, yet it usually comes from the visiting team's fans. The truth is, Miami fans are so damned casual and indifferent that rather than a diving dolphin, our logo should be of one reclining in a beach chair, wearing sunglasses and sipping a frosted beverage. Yet for a while there in the eighties/early nineties (coinciding with the peak Marino years), you were virtually guaranteed to witness some almost soccer-like hooliganism at Joe Robbie Stadium. This usually occurred during Buffalo games (New England was still in it's then ongoing period of suckage), and was idiotically insipid. Any true fan of football now recognizes that rivalry as having produced some of the finest football ever played on either side of the ball, but you wouldn't know this by the amount of drunken twits filling the stands who apparently came to the show only to engage in boorish behavior or fight.

Coincidentally, as both teams succumbed to a lengthy period of mediocrity, these "passionate" fans stopped coming to games altogether, reinforcing the idea that they were front-running phonies in the first place. By and large, I believe that little anomally speaks astutely about the nature of sports fans anywhere. And even if they do support a team during the lean years, people that come to games and treat the competition as secondary to drinking and brawling are no more of a sports fan than I am a rock star.