Discovered papers: Hanoi directed Kerry

[lucky wilbury]

nope

[McCarrens]

Originally posted by lucky wilbury
nope

I figured as much. I was just patronizing Ford, agreeing to his crazy ideas.

[lucky wilbury]

the cia doesn't need to keep people to keep tabs of ford. they hacked his computer last year :D

[McCarrens]

My bad, I forgot. I got that information in my weekly BCE newsletter.

[Nickdfresh]

Re: Discovered papers: Hanoi directed Kerry

Originally posted by lucky wilbury
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/ar...TICLE_ID=41106

Discovered papers: Hanoi directed Kerry
Recovered Vietnam documents 'smoking gun' researchers claim

The first documentary evidence that Vietnamese communists were directly steering John Kerry's antiwar group Vietnam Veterans Against the War has been discovered in a U.S. archive, according to a researcher who spoke with WorldNetDaily.

One freshly unearthed document, captured by the U.S. from Vietnamese communists in 1971, indicates the Viet Cong and North Vietnamese delegations to the Paris peace talks that year were used as the communications link to direct the activities of Kerry and other antiwar activists who attended.

Points, so much bullshit-so little time!:

LOL- Typical, but congressional investigations following Vietnam failed to disclose any major links between the U.S. Anti-War movement and Foriegn Intelligecne Services-North Vietnamese or otherwise. This statement reeks of run-of-the-mill right wing fantasy. I sorley doubt the Swift Boat Vet's really had much better luck.

-I hate to break this to everyone, but as an ex-member of Military Intelligence who served with numerous veterans that were in Counter-intelligence during the Vietnam era, it was routine for the FBI and Military to fabricate documents regarding anti-war activists in addition to spying on them illegally. In all probability, these documents are typical amateurish fakes whether they were conveniently "captured in 1972" or concocted in 2004. But in any case, I doubt anyone will pay much attention since the Swift Boat Vets Full of Shit have so aggrievously discredited their organization with easily refuted lie after lie.

-Recently released actual documents show that by 1970, the Nixon Administration knew that "Vietnamization" policy was a failure and the Theiu regime was on the verge of collapse. He was continuing high levels of US involvement in the war in order to prevent a total collapse of South Vietnam before the 1972 election. You tell me which is worse: 1.A man attempting to halt a pointless and lost war, he fought in, that was killing Americans -or- 2. Nixon sending troops to their death for his re-election campaign?

[HELLVIS]

I am the editor of the B C E newsletter, and I approve this thread.

[ODShowtime]

Re: Re: Discovered papers: Hanoi directed Kerry

Originally posted by Nickdfresh
Points, so much bullshit-so little time!:

LOL- Typical, but congressional investigations following Vietnam failed to disclose any major links between the U.S. Anti-War movement and Foriegn Intelligecne Services-North Vietnamese or otherwise. This statement reeks of run-of-the-mill right wing fantasy. I sorley doubt the Swift Boat Vet's really had much better luck.

-I hate to break this to everyone, but as an ex-member of Military Intelligence who served with numerous veterans that were in Counter-intelligence during the Vietnam era, it was routine for the FBI and Military to fabricate documents regarding anti-war activists in addition to spying on them illegally. In all probability, these documents are typical amateurish fakes whether they were conveniently "captured in 1972" or concocted in 2004. But in any case, I doubt anyone will pay much attention since the Swift Boat Vets Full of Shit have so aggrievously discredited their organization with easily refuted lie after lie.

-Recently released actual documents show that by 1970, the Nixon Administration knew that "Vietnamization" policy was a failure and the Theiu regime was on the verge of collapse. He was continuing high levels of US involvement in the war in order to prevent a total collapse of South Vietnam before the 1972 election. You tell me which is worse: 1.A man attempting to halt a pointless and lost war, he fought in, that was killing Americans -or- 2. Nixon sending troops to their death for his re-election campaign?

No one will touch this. Nick, you da man.

[John Ashcroft]

Re: Re: Discovered papers: Hanoi directed Kerry

Originally posted by Nickdfresh
In all probability, these documents are typical amateurish fakes whether they were conveniently "captured in 1972" or concocted in 2004.

Maybe we should get Dan Rather on it, huh?

And I suppose we could all take your word on the rest. I do hold personal experience over any op-ed posted here. But I suppose we could also ask for an some supporting evidence to your claims. Not necessarily your claim to being ex-intel, but for the claim of fabricated Anti-War protestor/Viet-Cong connection docs. All these years later there's got to be something on this that's public, no?

[Nickdfresh]

COINTEL

As far as being ex-intelligence, let me make one thing clear, I was merely a low-level Army clerk with a cool job title. The guys I knew were Dept. of the Army civilians that were retired sergeants and were my equivalent during the late 60's and early 70's.

I can only say I heard numerous stories, which I believed, about military personnel growing beards and their hair long and being asked to join The Black Panthers or to attend college and join student anti-war groups. This was all patently illegal since it violates the Posse Comitatus act of 1871(I think thats the date) which basically states that military personnel cannot be used as law enforcement or investigative resources except for in very specific circumstances such as under Martial Law or in policing a military installation. I have no official documents to present, but these abuses of power were well documented in the post-Vietnam Church Committee congressional investigations and referred to under the umbrella as COINTEL. Below is a nice little synapsis and overview of COINTEL in which the FBI managed military personnel in undercover operations. Unfortunately, according to Hoover, everyone was a communist if they opposed the U.S. Gov't or tried to affect positive social change.

http://www.icdc.com/~paulwolf/cointelpro/cointel.htm

COINTELPRO is an acronym for a series of FBI counterintelligence programs designed to neutralize political dissidents. Although covert operations have been employed throughout FBI history, the formal COINTELPRO's of 1956-1971 were broadly targeted against radical political organizations. In the early 1950s, the Communist Party was illegal in the United States. The Senate and House of Representatives each set up investigating committees to prosecute communists and publicly expose them. (The House Committee on Un-American Activities and the Senate Internal Security Subcommittee, led by Senator Joseph McCarthy). When a series of Supreme Court rulings in 1956 and 1957 challenged these committees and questioned the constitutionality of Smith Act prosecutions and Subversive Activities Control Board hearings, the FBI's response was COINTELPRO, a program designed to "neutralize" those who could no longer be prosecuted. Over the years, similar programs were created to neutralize civil rights, anti-war, and many other groups, all said to be "communist front organizations." As J. Edgar Hoover, longtime Director of the FBI, put it

The forces which are most anxious to weaken our internal security are not always easy to identify. Communists have been trained in deceit and secretly work toward the day when they hope to replace our American way of life with a Communist dictatorship. They utilize cleverly camouflaged movements, such as peace groups and civil rights groups to achieve their sinister purposes. While they as individuals are difficult to identify, the Communist party line is clear. Its first concern is the advancement of Soviet Russia and the godless Communist cause. It is important to learn to know the enemies of the American way of life.

The FBI conducted more than 2000 COINTELPRO operations before the the programs were officially discontinued in April of 1971, after public exposure, in order to "afford additional security to [their] sensitive techniques and operations." http://www.icdc.com/~paulwolf/cointelpro/cointel.htm

Kerry was a target after he testified.