CNN: U.S. ends search for WMD in Iraq

[kentuckyklira]

Originally posted by DLR'sCock
So over 100,000+ Iraqis dead, over 1300+ US soldiers dead, maybe over 30,000+ Iraqis seriously wounded, over 30,000 US soldiers seriously wounded, the country is a warzone, over $250 billion and counting, and no end in site....and no weapons of mass destruction to be found....


As I said there were none, it was bs.....but hey who gives a flying fuck right???

And don´t you dare forget Saddam was harbouring terrorists!

Honest!

For sure!

Could these eyes lie?

[kentuckyklira]

I wonder how many aeons in hell god (should he exist after all) has in store for those responsible for so much death and devastation based on a lie??!!??

[DEMON CUNT]

Originally posted by Big Train
That Saddam was a naughty man only comprises about 1 paragraph....

None of this stuff changes my opinions on what happened or what is going on, in fact, it confirms it in my mind.

And in such an ambiguous way, too! That's a Scott McClellan style cop out.

The fact that there is no evidence of what we had originally invaded Iraq for only solidifies the President's current position on the situation in Iraq.

[ODShowtime]

say what now

[LoungeMachine]

Originally posted by Big Train
depends on how you look at the glass..

The glass will greet us as Liberators.

There will be no need to shatter the glass.

We KNOW what is in the glass

The glass sought liquid from Niger

WE will fill the glass with democracy



[crash*********]



Oh shit, anybody gotta 'nuther glass? This one's broke.

[Big Train]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by DEMON CUNT
[B]And in such an ambiguous way, too! That's a Scott McClellan style cop out.

The fact that there is no evidence of what we had originally invaded Iraq for only solidifies the President's current position on the situation in Iraq.

Fuck you. You just want me to go through the whole process of debate again, but I won't. No cop out, just do a quick search, I'm sure you'll find all my previous discussions on this.

[Big Train]

Originally posted by LoungeMachine
The glass will greet us as Liberators.

There will be no need to shatter the glass.

We KNOW what is in the glass

The glass sought liquid from Niger

WE will fill the glass with democracy

The stuff in the glass also left a month ago...minor detail.

[Seshmeister]

CLAIM vs. FACT


Pre-War Intelligence Hype



CLAIM: "I expected to find the weapons [because] I based my decision on the best intelligence possible...The evidence I had was the best possible evidence that he had a weapon."



FACT - WHITE HOUSE REPEATEDY WARNED BY INTELLIGENCE COMMUNITY:



The Washington Post reported this weekend, "President Bush and his top advisers ignored many of the caveats and qualifiers included in the classified report on Saddam Hussein's weapons." Specifically, the President made unequivocal statements that Iraq "has got chemical weapons" two months after the DIA concluded that there was "no reliable information on whether Iraq is producing and stockpiling chemical weapons." He said, "Iraq has attempted to purchase high-strength aluminum tubes suitable for nuclear weapons production" three months after the White House received an intelligence report that clearly indicated Department of Energy experts concluded the tubes were not intended to produce uranium enrichment centrifuges. He said, "Saddam Hussein recently sought significant quantities of uranium from Africa," three months after "the CIA sent two memos to the White House in October voicing strong doubts about" the claim. [Sources: WP, 2/7/04; Bush statement, 11/3/02; DIA report, 2002; Bush statement, 1/28/03; NIE, October 2002; WP, 7/23/03; Bush statement, 10/7/02; WP, 9/26/03]



Ignoring Intelligence



CLAIM: "We looked at the intelligence."



FACT – WHITE HOUSE IGNORED INTELLIGENCE WARNINGS:



Knight Ridder reported that CIA officers "said President Bush ignored warnings" that his WMD case was weak. And Greg Thielmann, the Bush State Department's top intelligence official, "said suspicions were presented as fact, and contrary arguments ignored." Knight Ridder later reported, "Senior diplomatic, intelligence and military officials have charged that Bush and his top aides made assertions about Iraq's banned weapons programs and alleged links to al-Qaeda that weren't supported by credible intelligence, and that they ignored intelligence that didn't support their policies." [Knight-Ridder, 6/13/03; CBS News, 6/7/03; Knight Ridder, 6/28/03]



Ignoring International Intelligence Warnings



CLAIM: "The international community thought he had weapons."



FACT – INTERNATIONAL COMMUNITY TOLD WHITE HOUSE THE OPPOSITE:



The IAEA and U.N. both repeatedly told the Administration it had no evidence that Iraq possessed WMD. On 2/15/03, the IAEA said that, "We have to date found no evidence of ongoing prohibited nuclear or nuclear-related activities in Iraq." On 3/7/03 IAEA Director Mohamed ElBaradei said nuclear experts have found "no indication" that Iraq has tried to import high-strength aluminum tubes for centrifuge enrichment of uranium. At the same time, AP reported that "U.N. weapons inspectors have not found any 'smoking guns' in Iraq during their search for weapons WMD." AP also reported, "U.N. weapons inspector Hans Blix said his teams have not uncovered any WMD." [Source: U.S. State Department, 2/14/03; NY Times, 3/7/03; AP, 1/9/03; AP, 2/14/03]



Informing Congress of Intelligence Caveats



CLAIM: "I went to Congress with the same intelligence. Congress saw the same intelligence I had, and they looked at exactly what I looked at."



FACT – CONGRESS WAS OUTRAGED AT PRESENTATION BY THE WHITE HOUSE:



The New Republic reported, "Senators were outraged to find that intelligence info given to them omitted the qualifications and countervailing evidence that had characterized the classified version and played up the claims that strengthened the administration's case for war." According to Rep. Paul Kanjorski (D-PA), many House members were only convinced to support the war after the Administration "showed them a photograph of a small, unmanned airplane spraying a liquid in what appeared to be a test for delivering chemical and biological agents," despite the U.S. Air Force telling the Administration it "sharply disputed the notion that Iraq's UAVs were being designed as attack weapons." [Source: The New Republic, 6/30/03; Wilkes Barre Times Leader, 1/6/04; WP, 9/26/03]



Pre-War "Imminent Threat" Assertion



CLAIM: "I believe it is essential that when we see a threat, we deal with those threats before they become imminent. It's too late if they become imminent."



FACT – ADMINISTRATION REPEATEDLY CLAIMED IRAQ WAS AN "IMMINENT THREAT":



The Bush Administration repeatedly claimed that Iraq was an imminent threat before the war – not that it would "become imminent." Specifically, White House communications director Dan Bartlett was asked on CNN: "Is [Saddam Hussein] an imminent threat to US interests, either in that part of the world or to Americans right here at home?" Bartlett replied, "Well, of course he is." Similarly, when White House spokesman Ari Fleischer was asked whether America went to war in Iraq because of an imminent threat, he replied, "Absolutely." And White House spokesman Scott McClellan said the reason NATO allies – including the U.S. - should support the defense of one of its members from Iraq was because "this is about an imminent threat." Additionally, the Administration used "immediate," "urgent" and "mortal" to describe the Iraq threat to the United States. [Source: American Progress list, 1/29/04]



Bush's Threat Rhetoric Before the War



CLAIM: "I think, if I might remind you that in my language I called it a grave and gathering threat, but I don't want to get into word contests."



FACT – BUSH MADE FAR MORE DIRE STATEMENTS BEFORE THE WAR:



While the President did call Iraq a "grave and gathering" threat, that was not all he said. On 11/23/02, he said Iraq posed a "unique and urgent threat." On 1/3/03 he said "Iraq is a threat to any American." On 10/28/02 he said Iraq was "a real and dangerous threat" to America. On 10/2/02 he said, "The Iraqi regime is a threat of unique urgency" and that Iraq posed "a grave threat" to America. [Bush, 11/23/02; Bush; 1/3/03; Bush, 10/28/02; Bush, 10/2/02; Bush, 10/2/02]



Saddam-Al Qaeda-WMD Connection



CLAIM: "Iraq had the capacity to make a weapon and then let that weapon fall into the hands of a shadowy terrorist network."



FACT – ASSERTION BELIES PREVIOUS INTELLIGENCE ASSESSMENTS:



This assertion belies the 2002 National Intelligence Estimate which told the White House that Iraq would most likely only coordinate with Al Qaeda if the U.S. invaded Iraq. As the NYT reported, "[A] CIA assessment said last October: 'Baghdad for now appears to be drawing a line short of conducting terrorist attacks' in the United States." The CIA added that Saddam might order attacks with WMD as 'his last chance to exact vengeance by taking a large number of victims with him.'" Previously, the CIA had told the White House that Iraq "has not provided chemical or biological weapons to Al Qaeda or related terrorist groups." And David Kay himself said, " I found no real connection between WMD and terrorists" in Iraq. [Source: NIE, 2002; NY Times, 1/29/03; NY Times, 2/6/02; NBC News, 1/26/04]



David Kay's Report



CLAIM: "And when David Kay goes in and says we haven't found stockpiles yet, and there's theories as to where the weapons went. They could have been destroyed during the war. Saddam and his henchmen could have destroyed them as we entered into Iraq. They could be hidden. They could have been transported to another country, and we'll find out."



FACT – KAY ACTUALLY SAID WMD HAD BEEN DESTROYED AFTER 1991:



David Kay didn't say we haven't found the stockpiles of chemical weapons because they are destroyed, hidden or transported to another country. Kay said that they were never produced and hadn't been produced since 1991. As he said, "Multiple sources with varied access and reliability have told ISG that Iraq did not have a large, ongoing, centrally controlled CW program after 1991. Information found to date suggests that Iraq's large-scale capability to develop, produce and fill new CW munitions was reduced - if not entirely destroyed - during Operations Desert Storm and Desert Fox, 13 years of U.N. sanctions and U.N. inspections." [Kay Testimony, 2004]




Investigative Commissions



WMD Commission



CLAIM: "The reason why we gave it time is because we didn't want it to be hurried... it's important that this investigation take its time."



FACT – OTHER COMMISSIONS SHOW THAT THE REPORT IS BEING DELAYED FOR POLITICS:



Regardless of upcoming Parliamentary elections, British Prime Minister Tony Blair has set up a similar commission to investigate intelligence that will report by July. Additionally, in 1983 after the terrorist attack on U.S. troops in Beirut, a commission was appointed and completed its report within 2 months.



9/11 Commission



CLAIM: "We have given extraordinary cooperation with Chairmen Kean and Hamilton."



FACT – WHITE HOUSE HAS STONEWALLED THE 9/11 COMMISSION:



According to the Baltimore Sun, President Bush "opposed the outside inquiry" into September 11th. When Congress forced him to relent, Time Magazine reported he tried to choke its funding, noting, "the White House brushed off a request quietly made by 9-11 Commission Chairman Tom Kean" for adequate funding. Then, the NY Times reported, "President Bush declined to commit the White House to turning over highly classified intelligence reports to the independent federal commission investigating the Sept. 11, 2001, terror attacks, despite public threats of a subpoena from the bipartisan panel." And as the Akron Beacon Journal reported last week, "the 9/11 panel did not receive the speedy cooperation it expected. In a preliminary report last summer, the panel's co-chairmen, Thomas Kean, a Republican and former governor of New Jersey, and Lee Hamilton, a Democrat and former congressman from Indiana, complained about lengthy delays in gaining access to critical documents, federal employees and administration officials. They warned the lack of cooperation would prove damaging, ensuring that a full investigation would take that much longer to complete, if at all." [Source: Baltimore Sun, 6/14/02; Time Magazine, 3/26/03; NY Times, 10/27/03; Akron Beacon Journal 2/2/04]

[DEMON CUNT]

Originally posted by Big Train

Fuck you. You just want me to go through the whole process of debate again, but I won't. No cop out, just do a quick search, I'm sure you'll find all my previous discussions on this.

Fuck me?

Uh huh. Sure. No cop out here!

[DEMON CUNT]

Originally posted by Big Train
The stuff in the glass also left a month ago...minor detail.

And the WMD were gone a decade ago....MAJOR detail.

[Nickdfresh]

It's all Clinton's fault!

[diamondD]

Why do you deny Clinton's own admission that he believed the same thing? Does it hurt your hatred for Bush that much?

Everyone that's been around here knows I'm not the biggest Bill Clinton fan because I've been putting up with him since the first time I could vote, but he's stated repeatedly he believed these same intelligence reports.

[Nickdfresh]

Originally posted by diamondD
Why do you deny Clinton's own admission that he believed the same thing? Does it hurt your hatred for Bush that much?

Everyone that's been around here knows I'm not the biggest Bill Clinton fan because I've been putting up with him since the first time I could vote, but he's stated repeatedly he believed these same intelligence reports.

Because he wasn't in office spinning the shit out of the intelligence, believing only the reports he wanted to believe and essentially suppressing the ones that provide evidence against Iraqi WMD's. He listened to the different views regarding situations. He never did invade Iraq did he?

[diamondD]

No, but he says he BELIEVED them. He just didn't take action, which was typical.

There's no spinning your way out of it.

[Jesus Christ]

Originally posted by kentuckyklira
I wonder how many aeons in hell god (should he exist after all) has in store for those responsible for so much death and devastation based on a lie??!!??

It would be impossible for a mortal man to count that high, My son.