Life without college

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  • academic punk
    Full Member Status

    • Dec 2004
    • 4437

    Life without college

    This scares me more than anything else in this forum...



    A new survey of young adults on their plans after high school finds they understand the limitations of life without a college degree, but often lack the money, motivation or guidance to pursue higher education.

    The survey, conducted by the nonpartisan research group Public Agenda, also shows that most young people who forgo college find themselves falling into jobs by chance. Nearly half of the respondents who didn't attend college said their current job was "just a job to get by" and only 15 percent viewed their jobs as promising careers.

    The decision not to attend college carries more significance in a shifting economy with fewer well-paying jobs available for less-skilled workers. Manufacturing jobs have been steadily declining, and in fact, the economy has lost more than 2.5 million manufacturing jobs over the past four years.

    That not only represents 15 percent of total manufacturing jobs in this country, but the trend is growing as the United States continues to outsource factory jobs and sign often one-sided free trade agreements. And while service jobs have been increasing, many of those new jobs are in health and educational services, areas that require at least some post-high school training.

    Even a job as a police officer -- once a good career for someone with only a high school degree -- is growing out of reach as police departments seek to recruit more college graduates, noted Jean Johnson, senior vice president and director of programs at Public Agenda.

    "Lots of people aren't academically inclined and there are still lots of ways to earn a living," Johnson said. "But what you see in these young people is it's a very hit-or-miss road they're on."

    The most recent available statistics from the U.S. Department of Labor show the unemployment rate for high school graduates with no college experience was 14 percent. The unemployment rate in 2003 for young people with college degrees, in contrast, was 7 percent.

    While young people overwhelmingly agreed on the value of a college education, about half of those who didn't go on to college said they couldn't afford to go, had too many other responsibilities or wanted to start working to earn money. Others, however, said the most important reason for skipping college was that their grades and motivation were too low, their teachers hadn't prepared them well or their career goals did not require a college degree.

    Most of the young people surveyed believe their financial situation will improve as they get older, and that eventually they will be better off than their parents. "If you look at statistics about their economic prospects, it's not really as promising," Johnson said. "Yet personally, they are optimistic."

    But their reasons for optimism may diminish as these young people face the reality of a changing job market.
  • Little_Skittles
    Foot Soldier
    • Dec 2004
    • 557

    #2
    That is exactly why high school stresses the importance of knowing what field you wish to go into. Just the other day at our sophmore meeting we were discussing how seniors go through high school, then say wait i want to do this and didn't take any courses to prepare them for that job market.

    People scholarships are available if you are poor. Tons of them for everything and everyone just start asking questions.
    Do you love me peter? Yes of course my lord. Then feed my sheep.

    Comment

    • academic punk
      Full Member Status

      • Dec 2004
      • 4437

      #3
      does high school stress the importance of knowing what field you want to go into? I just rmember a lot of shitty classes that seemed to have no relevance to what any of us wanted to do with our lives.

      Then again, the time I spent in college really molded me into the person I am. I grew up in the 'burbs, and had never even heard or thought about things like "feminism", "prochoice", even "politics".

      I would never have developed an appreciation for art history, literature, or ecology without the three years I spent at Vassar (which thanks to scholarships, cost me less than even a state school).

      And my whole world is much richer for the year I spent abroad in Edinburgh, Scotland. Invaluable and irreplaceable.

      Even if your college experience has no direct correlation to what you wind up doing for a living, it's still something that everyone should experience. You have a;ll the rest of your life to work.

      Comment

      • Little_Skittles
        Foot Soldier
        • Dec 2004
        • 557

        #4
        that' right. yes they do nowadays stress the importance of your future 4 short years and we're out on our own.
        Do you love me peter? Yes of course my lord. Then feed my sheep.

        Comment

        • Little_Skittles
          Foot Soldier
          • Dec 2004
          • 557

          #5
          that' right. yes they do nowadays stress the importance of your future 4 short years and we're out on our own.
          Do you love me peter? Yes of course my lord. Then feed my sheep.

          Comment

          • academic punk
            Full Member Status

            • Dec 2004
            • 4437

            #6
            here's an e-mail from a friend who I also forwarded this article to...

            Down in D.C., the Dept. of Education is making a big effort to tout "No
            Child Left Behind." Not only are there enormous banners atop some of
            the buildings emblazoned with WWW.NOCHILDLEFTBEHIND.GOV, every entrance to the Education building--and there are many--has a new entryway constructed, like large versions of the vestibules that restaurants put up in winter to keep out drafts. There are dozens of these things, two story high red schoolhouses with the No Child Left Behind logo, to remind everyone who enters the building that school is important, and so is the Bush administration's policy.

            I hope you are relieved to know that our government is taking
            substantive action to correct the problem you identified in your email.

            Chris

            Comment

            • Nickdfresh
              SUPER MODERATOR

              • Oct 2004
              • 49567

              #7
              Originally posted by academic punk
              here's an e-mail from a friend who I also forwarded this article to...

              Down in D.C., the Dept. of Education is making a big effort to tout "No
              Child Left Behind." Not only are there enormous banners atop some of
              the buildings emblazoned with WWW.NOCHILDLEFTBEHIND.GOV, every entrance to the Education building--and there are many--has a new entryway constructed, like large versions of the vestibules that restaurants put up in winter to keep out drafts. There are dozens of these things, two story high red schoolhouses with the No Child Left Behind logo, to remind everyone who enters the building that school is important, and so is the Bush administration's policy.

              I hope you are relieved to know that our government is taking
              substantive action to correct the problem you identified in your email.

              Chris
              No Child Left Behind is a bunch of horseshit. All it has done is to further dumb-down the education system as a whole.

              The recurring theme of it is States give standardized tests, many students cannot pass them because they went to underfunded schools. OR districts throw the test scores by faking grades or use lenient grading to make themselves look good.

              The States begin to drop standards and the higher level honors students suffer because they are unable attend classes with the trend towards homogenization, and poor students that only want to learn a trade must meet the same standards as an Ivy League recruit that is inclined towards school work. It's just really stupid and self-defeating to put everyone in the same category.

              We need to take a look at what European educators do such as in Germany, where students are given aptitude tests early and are educated accordingly to their interests, skills, and goals.

              Comment

              • DrMaddVibe
                ROTH ARMY ELITE
                • Jan 2004
                • 6686

                #8
                There is no way you can compare any European nation's education systems to ours. They practice a loose system of socialism and their taxes go towards a further education as well as socialized medicine.
                http://i185.photobucket.com/albums/x...auders1zl5.gif
                http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c4...willywonka.gif

                Comment

                • Nickdfresh
                  SUPER MODERATOR

                  • Oct 2004
                  • 49567

                  #9
                  Originally posted by DrMaddVibe
                  There is no way you can compare any European nation's education systems to ours. They practice a loose system of socialism and their taxes go towards a further education as well as socialized medicine.
                  I don't think that's true exactly. I don't know, but I've heard we actually spend the most on secondary education than any other nation. And I realize that comparisons are difficult since most nations that score above the US in math and the sciences deceptively test only their best students. We test a statistical sampling of our entire school population. It's like going to the Olympics with amateurs and playing the professionals.

                  Comment

                  • DrMaddVibe
                    ROTH ARMY ELITE
                    • Jan 2004
                    • 6686

                    #10
                    Kinda like the Russian hockey teams of yesteryear?

                    Gimmie a break.
                    http://i185.photobucket.com/albums/x...auders1zl5.gif
                    http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c4...willywonka.gif

                    Comment

                    • academic punk
                      Full Member Status

                      • Dec 2004
                      • 4437

                      #11
                      and with each passing day we ARE developing more and more into a nation of amateurs!

                      Comment

                      • capnfrantic
                        Full On Cocktard
                        • Nov 2004
                        • 26

                        #12
                        " but the trend is growing as the United States continues to outsource factory jobs and sign often one-sided free trade agreements."

                        Yeah that makes sense, we don't have any factory jobs so why should I go to college?

                        "Others, however, said the most important reason for skipping college was that their grades and motivation were too low, their teachers hadn't prepared them well or their career goals did not require a college degree"

                        Can you say study?Teachers not motivating? How would you like to have a masters degree and make 35K a year and be held accountable for preparing kids half of don't give a shit? Career goals without a degree? Must be talking about those factory jobs we gave away....

                        "No Child Left Behind is a bunch of horseshit."

                        I agree, I'm not waiting for the Gov't to make my kid sucessful. I am taking that responsibility on myself.

                        Push the blame somewhere just don't let it fall in your lap.....

                        Comment

                        • academic punk
                          Full Member Status

                          • Dec 2004
                          • 4437

                          #13
                          I have no idea if the above post is critical or in agreement with the article. Genius!!!

                          no, really...are you saying a colege degree isn't worthwhile, b/c of the careers it can give these days (you're not entirely wrong if you are)

                          or that the degree and diploma are important for the future b/c the job prospects without it are worse than ever? (they are)

                          are you saying the educaiton system is lacking? (it is)

                          are you saying you'll take a more active hand in your child's upbringing and not just shoving him/her on the bus and tell him, "come back home smarter" (good for you!)

                          "Is our children learning?"

                          Who said it? who said it? first correct response wins a boysenbery jelly bean...

                          Comment

                          • capnfrantic
                            Full On Cocktard
                            • Nov 2004
                            • 26

                            #14
                            No
                            Yes
                            Yes
                            I have to...NO Choice
                            Can't do jelly beans...

                            I just think the blame is not put where it should be alot of times.There is still alot of opportunity for kids out there,but too many excuses why they can't take advantage of it. JMO

                            Comment

                            • academic punk
                              Full Member Status

                              • Dec 2004
                              • 4437

                              #15
                              so where should hte balme be? the parents? what sort of opportunities, what sort of excuses? pray tell, i'm interested...

                              Comment

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