The Enemy on Our Airwaves

[Nickdfresh]

Originally posted by lucky wilbury
you can see funerals for us service people if you live in the area that the funeral is taking place. happens all the time. vietnam was a winable war. all major battles were won but we lost the pr war. even the vietnamesse propaganda minister went on us tv after the war and said the us media was the best weapon the they had. thats the only battle they won they convinced everyone it was unwinable and the us media played along.

Vietnam was unwinnable becuase we kept lying to the American people. Have you ever heard the term "Siagon Press Conference?" When you tell people that you have been eradicating the enemy and that the end is in sight, then they launch a major offensive "on national TV," are people just supposed to ignore that?

what is a pointless war? koera? world war 2? world war 1? they were all pointless to us since we weren't threated except for japan in wwii yet we still fought and died. us in europe in wwii would be illegal since hitler never attacked us.

Wrong!! Germany declared war on the US on December 15th 1941! How would fighting them be illegal?

same with musolini. same with korea and same with ww1 and if the public were shown what happen at normandy they would have wanted to know why we were there after all japan attacked us not germany.

The United States faced possible invasion if the UK or the USSR fell. The Wehrmacht was a far cry from the mighty juggernaut that was the Iraqi Army!

[Seshmeister]

Originally posted by lucky wilbury
what is a pointless war? koera? world war 2? world war 1? they were all pointless to us since we weren't threated except for japan in wwii yet we still fought and died. us in europe in wwii would be illegal since hitler never attacked us. same with musolini. same with korea and same with ww1 and if the public were shown what happen at normandy they would have wanted to know why we were there after all japan attacked us not germany.

But I thought we had rewritten all that history now?

I thought the US got involved to save the Jews and stop the gas chambers?

Ahh wouldn't it be great to all live in Spielbergs world?

95% of wars are about economics and money. The problem is that the rich folk that run the countries can never admit that, In olden times they could because they would give their armies some of the spoils but not nowadays.

The whole of Europe apart from Britain as part of the USSR? Not good for the US economy I think.

Cheers!

[Seshmeister]

Originally posted by lucky wilbury
the beheading and killing video seem to get al jazeera their highest ratings. anything with blood and gore their right there. it not the point of showing the videos in the west its their existance that helps the terrorists

This is a 24 hour news station and you are talking about 20 minutes worth in the last 2 years.

Sure it's propoganda but I can't believe how few pictures of dead kids with arms and legs missing were not shown on TV here after the inital bombing of Iraq.

[lucky wilbury]

Originally posted by Nickdfresh
Vietnam was unwinnable becuase we kept lying to the American people. Have you ever heard the term "Siagon Press Conference?" When you tell people that you have been eradicating the enemy and that the end is in sight, then they launch a major offensive "on national TV," are people just supposed to ignore that?

that is a lame excuse. then by that definition ww2 was un winnable becuase after all the government told lies during that war as well. we're taking over this island and that island and pay no mind to the fact that air craft carrier or two were sunk were still going strong!

Originally posted by Nickdfresh
Wrong!! Germany declared war on the US on December 15th 1941! How would fighting them be illegal?

your missing the point. unless were attacked to most people were not at war. saddam did declare war on us in 91 and then he went on to violate a cease fire there for the resumption of a state of war exists.

Originally posted by Nickdfresh
The United States faced possible invasion if the UK or the USSR fell. The Wehrmacht was a far cry from the mighty juggernaut that was the Iraqi Army!

ah yes that mighty germany navy needed to cross the atlantic lead by the mighty aircraft carrier???? the germans didn't have the navy nor the manpower to launch and invaision of the us. the japanese even with their navy never dared to invade the us main land and the distance between the us and japan and the us and germany was to great for anyone to mount and invasion of the us.

[lucky wilbury]

Originally posted by Seshmeister
This is a 24 hour news station and you are talking about 20 minutes worth in the last 2 years.

Sure it's propoganda but I can't believe how few pictures of dead kids with arms and legs missing were not shown on TV here after the inital bombing of Iraq.

and some of those kids were killed by saddams own doing. anyone still have the copy of the bbc article from that talked about saddams own rockets misfiring and blowing up in market places?

[Seshmeister]

You're reaching now.

Tens of thousands of US munitions v. 1 antiaircraft missile that landed in a marketplace...

[lucky wilbury]

not reaching. i'd also like to point out that when saddams aa went up it had to come down someplace. plus i'd also like to point out that we we mostly hiting armour and military instalations.

[Seshmeister]

Mostly indeed.

Look I know I'm not going to convert you here but hopefully I've given you something to think about.

Cheers!

[Dr. Love]

Originally posted by Seshmeister
95% of wars are about economics and money.

And 67% of all statistics are made up on the spot.

[lucky wilbury]

Originally posted by Seshmeister
Mostly indeed.

Look I know I'm not going to convert you here but hopefully I've given you something to think about.

Cheers!

i know what happens in war i also know what happens when you don't act and i also know we do our damnest for better or worse to avoid civilian casualties including putting our guys at greater risk.

[Nickdfresh]

Originally posted by lucky wilbury
that is a lame excuse. then by that definition ww2 was un winnable becuase after all the government told lies during that war as well. we're taking over this island and that island and pay no mind to the fact that air craft carrier or two were sunk were still going strong!

No, that's lame logic! The US was facing an actual adversary that could destroy us during Vietnam, the USSR and we had a host of other problems we ignored (like modernizing our military which we instead ground down during the war). We were pumping resources into a country that we could ill afford to support. Our main ally, the South Vietnamese were corrupt cowards unable to defend themselves without massive US fire support. We killed 100,000's of Vietnamese, many civilians, and for what? Yes! Vietnam was unwinable, it was not worth ONE AMERICAN LIFE! It's all about pride for you guys, like the big fucking game we lost isn't it!

We betrayed the Vietnamese by letting the people you so hate reclaim their country, FRANCE! Ho Che Minh was the one fighting the Japanese while the French helped them police their occupied territory! Stop selectively quoting your history!

your missing the point. unless were attacked to most people were not at war. saddam did declare war on us in 91 and then he went on to violate a cease fire there for the resumption of a state of war exists.

No! You're revising history to serve your arguments! Saddam invaded another sovereign state and we had the UN and most of the Middle East behind us (except for our friends in Jordan). What exactly did he do this time other than fuck himself over?

ah yes that mighty germany navy needed to cross the atlantic lead by the mighty aircraft carrier???? the germans didn't have the navy nor the manpower to launch and invaision of the us. the japanese even with their navy never dared to invade the us main land and the distance between the us and japan and the us and germany was to great for anyone to mount and invasion of the us.

If they had conquered England, then they may have had a nice Navy!

And they didn't have an Air Force in 1936! Give a couple of years, they were actually working on an aircraft carrier before things were turning bad.

[lucky wilbury]

Originally posted by Nickdfresh
No, that's lame logic! The US was facing an actual adversary that could destroy us during Vietnam, the USSR and we had a host of other problems we ignored (like modernizing our military which we instead ground down during the war). We were pumping resources into a country that we could ill afford to support. Our main ally, the South Vietnamese were corrupt cowards unable to defend themselves without massive US fire support. We killed 100,000's of Vietnamese, many civilians, and for what? Yes! Vietnam was unwinable, it was not worth ONE AMERICAN LIFE! It's all about pride for you guys, like the big fucking game we lost isn't it!

We betrayed the Vietnamese by letting the people you so hate reclaim their country, FRANCE! Ho Che Minh was the one fighting the Japanese while the French helped them police their occupied territory! Stop selectively quoting your history!

vietnam was winable and it was more about land and more about the veitnamese. it was about showing the soviets we would "go anywhere and pay any price" to defend freedom and democracy. it showed the soviets that we would take the loses nesseary to stand up for pricipales. its the same thing we did in korea. we went there unprovoked and stood up for our beliefs and lost as many men there in a shorter amount of time then we did in vietnam

Originally posted by Nickdfresh
No! You're revising history to serve your arguments! Saddam invaded another sovereign state and we had the UN and most of the Middle East behind us (except for our friends in Jordan). What exactly did he do this time other than fuck himself over?

the un just stood by in 91. we ran the show and called the shots. what did saddam do? he let his time run out thats what. and we had the middle east with us this time. can't keep centcom in qatar if their not with us. can't use kuwait if their not with us. can't use navy base in the uae if their not with us. same with saudi arabia and on and on. the only countries that weren't with us this time that were with us last time were france, and germany. the russians stood on the sideline in 91 and the same this time

Originally posted by Nickdfresh
If they had conquered England, then they may have had a nice Navy!

i doubt it. the brits unlike the french weren't about to run out and support the germans once the invaded like the french did.

Originally posted by Nickdfresh
And they didn't have an Air Force in 1936! Give a couple of years, they were actually working on an aircraft carrier before things were turning bad.

it wouldn't matter if the had an aircraft carrier or not. its to big of a distance for them to have to resupply.

[BigBadBrian]

Originally posted by Seshmeister
Let's talk about propoganda then.


How many funerals have you seen for US casualties in Iraq?

I've seen partial coverage of two in the last week. On the TV news (including FOX) and in the newspaper.

[FORD]

So Al Jazeera is based in Qatar? But isn't Qatar essentially a BCE/oil corporation client state? Isn't PNAC invasion CentCom there, for fucks sake? So how is that possible?

If anti-Americanism was the purpose of the network, wouldn't it make more sense to be based in an Arab country where Americans were NOT in charge?

Unless Al Jazeera has been a joint CIA/Mossad project all along. And that's certainly a possibility that has been raised before.

[lucky wilbury]

lets bring this all back to the point: if al jazeera is a terrorist propaganda tool should us networks be involved in buisness deals with them?