WORLD WAR II Question

[Rikk]

I just wanted to post this here because more people in this forum could/would answer it. I know this forum is usually for current politics, but hey...

Why did Hitler invade Russia after making a pact with them that included Poland? While I believe he would have lost in the end (the Americans), the war would have lasted a lot longer and the Americans would have had a lot less time and less troops for the Pacific effort. It just seems startling that Hitler could imagine he would ever have beaten the Russians...especially on Russian soil. It was probably the biggest mistake made by any of the powers during WW II.

[Atomic Dyver]

Hitler was politcal mind not a great military mind. Most of his failures were from not listening to his generals. Hitler based most of what he did on German volk (german folklore) which stated that germans were decendants of arians and they were to dominate "inferior" races. Russians were considered inferior and he believed that 1: he was luring them into a false sense of security and 2: that his german supermen would defeat them even against the Russian winter. What did favor germany was technology and war theory. At the time the blitzkrieg was a combination of speed and technology (for the time) His ignorance (and he was warned) did not take into account that weather conditions would negate supply lines and the speed and accuracy of the blitzkrieg.

This ignorance also cost him at Dunkirk (backing off the panzers and allowing the luftwaffe to attack) and not building long range 4 engine bombers.

However even if he did not make these mistakes our industrial might and tactics would have beat him in the end.

Absolute power induces absolute ignorance.

[Nickdfresh]

Attacking the USSR was Hitler's singular, overriding goal. He saw the defeat of Bolshevism as paving the way for the Third Reich and the "triumph of National Socialism" worldwide. He never had any intentions of keeping his pact, it was just a stalling tactic to keep the Soviets off is ass while he invaded Western Europe.

BTW, Stalin had a plan to attack Germany, incidentally.

Hitler envisioned the Ukraine as the Third Reich's "breadbasket and the vast expanses of the SU for "Leibenstraum," or colonisation and the Slavs as inferiors worthy of only slavery and death.

Here's some more info:

http://www.ww2incolor.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2570

[Rikk]

Yeah, I was intrigued because I just got the World War II documentary THE WORLD AT WAR (BBC, from the mid-70s, narrated by Lawrence Olivier). Great and thorough documentary...anyone else seen it?

Anyway, I just can't believe the blunders. The maniac could have controlled Europe if:

1) The Americans had elected the Republican candidate in 1940, who was totally against entering the war.

2) The Japanese had found other ways to gain oil and other supplies and thus not needed to attack Pearl Harbor and domination of some of the surrounding regions.

3) If Hitler had never entered into an alliance with the Japanese in the first place.

4) If Russia and Germany had been able to co-exist...unlikely. That would have made the Cold War that eventually occurred seem mild.

[Atomic Dyver]

Another key mistake was starting WW2 when he did. At the time Chamberlains policy of appeasement was to stop war. After WW1 europe did not want another general war and was willing to go to great lengths to avoid it. Thus buying the Nazis time to complete the weapons they were developing.

Had he waited he would've had jet fighters, better rockets and control systems and a stronger navy which he needed to defeat England.

By not beating England he gave us the launchpad to win the war.

[hideyoursheep]

Originally posted by Atomic Dyver
Hitler was politcal mind not a great military mind. Most of his failures were from not listening to his generals...

Damn that sounds familiar....

[Atomic Dyver]

History does repeat itself....and often gives the answers to the future

[Atomic Dyver]

One last note on Russia when they were attacked: at the time the Russians were large in numbers but were not technologically advanced. They had all antiquated equipment: their tanks, planes and ships were a joke at the time.

The technology they used for the cold war were from us and german equipment captured from WW2. During the war we gave them tanks, planes and weapons.

[FORD]

As others have hinted at already, Chimpy and Hitler have a lot of similarities in their mentality as well as their tactics.

These BCE/PNAC/Likud neocon shitbags have ALWAYS over-estimated their own abilities. They claimed Iraq would be a "cakewalk", which was complete ignorance not of only history, but more recent opinions including, ironically enough, Chimpy's own father, who had a better opportunity to invade Baghdad then Chimpy did, but wisely turned it down because Poppy understood the stability that Saddam brought to the country, and the futility of trying to keep three different ethnicities tied together in an artificial country. Poppy was even proven right in post-Soviet Yugoslavia which had a similar ethnic dynamic and ended up a mess of sectarian violence.

Hitler had the same arrogant mentality. He thought he was literally destined to lead a great world empire which would last for a thousand years. That arrogance led him to believe he could eventually take down Stalin, but at least Adolf had the brains to realize he couldn't do so in the early stages of the war.

The difference is that at least Hitler had some success to parade before his own people in order to ensure their loyalty. He brought Germany out of the economic nightmare they were in as a direct result of WWI. He built the Autobahn, which was the first freeway system on the planet. He commissioned the creation of the Volkswagon as an affordable vehicle for all German families, and that company continues to do well even now.

If Hitler had stopped there, he might have been fondly remembered as a great leader, despite the fact that his prejudice against certain folks was already well established.

Chimp, on the other hand has NO success at anything which commands loyalty from the American people. It's all the whore media propping him up.

If Hitler had today's corporate media, he would have easily won World War II

[Nitro Express]

Originally posted by Atomic Dyver
One last note on Russia when they were attacked: at the time the Russians were large in numbers but were not technologically advanced. They had all antiquated equipment: their tanks, planes and ships were a joke at the time.

The technology they used for the cold war were from us and german equipment captured from WW2. During the war we gave them tanks, planes and weapons.

Yes, but Russia had it's arms factories inland by the Ural mountains. They had one of the best tanks in WWII and produced them in mass numbers. The Russians also understood fighting in cold weather more than the Germans did.

[Nickdfresh]

Originally posted by Atomic Dyver
One last note on Russia when they were attacked: at the time the Russians were large in numbers but were not technologically advanced. They had all antiquated equipment: their tanks, planes and ships were a joke at the time.

The technology they used for the cold war were from us and german equipment captured from WW2. During the war we gave them tanks, planes and weapons.

Not true at all, the Soviet Red Army had some of the finest equipment such as the T-34 tank. They received a lot of help from the US and UK, but they had some very good weapons....

[Atomic Dyver]

Originally posted by Nickdfresh
Not true at all, the Soviet Red Army had some of the finest equipment such as the T-34 tank. They received a lot of help from the US and UK, but they had some very good weapons....

The Nazis invaded in 1941, at the time there were very few t-34's as full scale production began that year. Russian weapons were improving but were not advanced when they were initially attacked. But no question the T-34 was a great tank.

[hideyoursheep]

....I wonder how different the world would be if Patton had his way?

[Atomic Dyver]

Hey the man had a tank named after him...he only knew one way to win.

[hideyoursheep]

We need that guy right now....