Gitmo: A National Disgrace

[Nickdfresh]

Originally posted by Hyman Roth
Exactamundo and well said, as usual, Nick.

Thanks man. It's good to see you 'round here on a regular basis Hyman. You've a great mind, please share more often...

[Hyman Roth]

Damn, Nick - that's like the nicest thing anyone has ever said to me on these boards. Dude I wish I had a fraction of the knowledge you carry around about all the issues that get debated around here.

If you get some time, check out this link. These are the guys that are representing many of the detainees. Its William Kunstler's old firm. There's a lot of info on there I have been trying to sift through to get up to speed on this. I don't know why this one struck such a nerve with me....I heard a story on NPR a few weeks back I guess....anyhoo, thanks for your kind words!

http://www.ccr-ny.org/v2/home.asp

[Hyman Roth]

Originally posted by Nickdfresh
... And even if they weren't, I don't believe fighting in a legitimate military formation constitutes being labeled a "terrorist," because otherwise, US troops could be "terrorists" in someone else's court. Couldn't they? ...

But help me understand ...isn't one of the legitimate issues here whether or not these detainees were "fighting in a legitimate military formation". If they were...then they get tried under the Genova Conventions...and then I guess they get the kind of trial like Milosovich received (and the Nuerenburg trials)...right...? Then I guess another catagory could be just "enemy combatants"...in which case they get treated how...and then what is the difference between a "enemy combatant" and an "unlawful enemy combatant"....if you have a quick answer...you could save me some time reading this shit on my monitor (I'm starting to get a crick in my neck!!).

[Nickdfresh]

Originally posted by Hyman Roth
But help me understand ...isn't one of the legitimate issues here whether or not these detainees were "fighting in a legitimate military formation". If they were...then they get tried under the Genova Conventions...

No. They get held as POWs for the duration, so send 'em back to Afghanistan and let the Kabul gov't deal with the locals, and send everyone else back to their countries of origin, or charge the few actual plotters with actual terror related charges for the big cunts like Khalid Sheik Mohammad.

and then I guess they get the kind of trial like Milosovich received (and the Nuerenburg trials)...right...? Then I guess another catagory could be just "enemy combatants"...in which case they get treated how...and then what is the difference between a "enemy combatant" and an "unlawful enemy combatant"....if you have a quick answer...you could save me some time reading this shit on my monitor (I'm starting to get a crick in my neck!!).

The difference is semantical. The Admin has claimed that we were essentially fighting spies that were not wearing uniforms when in fact they were in militia battle dress consistent with the fighting in that part of the world since the late 1970s.

If you're a lawyer, and I don't know you are, you may want to research the case where the six German spies were arrested and executed during WWII after they landed on the east coast to conduct sabotage. I believe that case is where the Bush Admin derives its (deeply flawed) precedents from, though I'm no lawyer and I could be very wrong in that assumption...

In any case, GITMO should be closed and the guys there charged or released...

[Hyman Roth]

Thanks for the input - I read with interest the post on the german spies mentioned by WallyG...I had heard about that matter before but not in great detail. I'll definitely check into it more.

And....I have a special practice....limited to only one client.



Nah - seriously - I sent out an email to Kunstler's old firm in the link above the other day begging them to let me help them pro bono. I'll let you know if I hear back from them.

For anyone that is interested, here's other informative blogs on the issue:

http://gtmodocuments.blogspot.com/

http://gtmoblog.blogspot.com/

[Hyman Roth]

Man labeled "enemy combatant" wins court case

Mon Jun 11, 2007 12:59PM EDT

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - President George W. Bush cannot order the military to seize and indefinitely detain a Qatari national and suspected al Qaeda operative, the only person being held in the United States as an "enemy combatant," an appeals court ruled on Monday.

In a major setback for Bush's policies in the war on terrorism adopted after the September 11 attacks, the appellate panel ruled 2-1 the U.S. government had no evidence to treat Ali Saleh Kahlah al-Marri as an "enemy combatant." The court ordered him released from military custody....

http://www.reuters.com/article/newsOne/idUSWAT00770820070611

========

The decision was handed in today in the 4th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals...

[studly hungwell]

Non citizens are not to be afforded the same rights as citizens of the United States. It really pisses me off when people talk about "rights" of immigrants, terrorists, enemy combatants, etc. It's a big deal to be a US citizen. Citizens have access to due process and the courts. Non citizens should not. For every non-citizen granted a court date, there is a citizen being denied access to the courts. Sounds hardcore and hateful but true.

[Nickdfresh]

Yeah, that explains why the Bouche administration wanted to hold American citizens as "enemy combatants."

It's something called a slippery slope that unethical, self righteous stupid people fall into all of the time...

And the Judicial system HAS worked reasonably well against terrorists. The Blind Sheik is a prime example. He's now in the bowels of the US prison system and is completely ignored by pretty much everyone. He's now a terrorist nonperson.

Fucking Gitmo is a sham, and even many conservatives have called for its closing because it's such an embarrassment..

[Hyman Roth]

Originally posted by Nickdfresh
Yeah, that explains why the Bouche administration wanted to hold American citizens as "enemy combatants."

It's something called a slippery slope that unethical, self righteous stupid people fall into all of the time...

And the Judicial system HAS worked reasonably well against terrorists. The Blind Sheik is a prime example. He's now in the bowels of the US prison system and is completely ignored by pretty much everyone. He's now a terrorist nonperson.

Fucking Gitmo is a sham, and even many conservatives have called for its closing because it's such an embarrassment..

LOL - terroristica non gratis.

Some polititian out of Switzerland is making a deal out of The Shiek being tortured first in secret CIA camps in Poland or Romania. ...another thread?

Originally posted by studly hungwell
Non citizens are not to be afforded the same rights as citizens of the United States. It really pisses me off when people talk about "rights" of immigrants, terrorists, enemy combatants, etc. It's a big deal to be a US citizen. Citizens have access to due process and the courts. Non citizens should not. For every non-citizen granted a court date, there is a citizen being denied access to the courts. Sounds hardcore and hateful but true.

You know what - you've convinced me. Let's just line them all up, put a slug in the back of all their heads and dump the bodies in some Cuban swamp. Fuck it, they don't need a trial. Do it tomorrow morning. They should have been born in America where we are lucky that we hold certain "truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness".

By the way - the quote is from the Declaration of Independence. I want to be sure to type the source for everything I post on this message board. I wouldn't want to be accosted by an alias on a some pathetic mission and accused of "internet plagiarism" - whateverthefuck that is. It must be a big deal to academia. Of course funny pictures I just saved in my hard drive while surfing who knows when, I will never be able to post, because I can't remember where they came from.... ...gee, I wonder if I should post all the signatories to that national treasure to be safe....can I log on later and do that?