Repuke Debate 9-22-01: Fuckwit Freaks on FAUX

[Seshmeister]

Even if you did believe that every species on this planet was designed by God in its current form, it's a special kind of arrogance to assume He would have done so just for the benefit of human consumption.

And of course the flipside...

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[FORD]

Meanwhile in Florida, the state chair of pRick Perry's campaign thinks God is causing tornados and earthquakes and shit because He's pissed off about gay weddings......

[jhale667]

So you KNOW the earth is 6,000 years old?



Link please

Yeah, like that'll happen...

[Nitro Express]

I think maybe one of the most arrogant things of all is actors who thank god in their acceptance speeches for awards.

If you think about that, they are saying that there is a supreme being who created a trillion stars in the universe who has personally intervened to make them win a prize for dressing up and pretending, in preference to 4 other bozos he didn't like as much.

It makes perfect sense when you look at religion as a business. People like to feel special. Religion always markets that big time. I am a prophet or messenger of God. Do everything that I say and God will give you better rewards in heaven than those other heathens because you are special.

In other words, let me abuse you because you are more special and God cares about you more than the others who refuse to be part of our chosen group. It's the oldest scam going. The earth may not really be six thousand years old but the scam probably is.

Anyways, you just don't nip thousands of years of tradition overnight. As far as the politics go it's just certain politicians playing to their base. A base going nowhere. They don't decide who is president either. The swing voters do who show no religious or party loyalty. These people just care how their vote affects their lively hood and pocket book. They tend to vote against something more than they vote for something. So what ever party convinces them they are the one that is less fucked up than the other one get enough votes to get their puppet into office.

[hambon4lif]

[Nitro Express]

There are certainly legitimate religious based charities. On the other hand, there are also scams like Pat Robertson's "Operation Blessing" which is really a money laundering scam for his African diamond mines. And there's nothing at all "charitable" or "Christian" about right wing political funding.

If religious donations were taxed and church's paid income tax you would see religion in this country dwindle like crazy. The main big appeal of it is you can make tax free income and if you are good at playing the game you can literally control billions of dollars and millions of people. Condense that in one area and you wield huge political control as well. Whole states are controlled by one religion.

[FORD]

Well, Utah is a special case, considering the first white folks there WERE all members of that particular religion. So they got in early, set up the entire infrastructure of the cities and states, based around the Mormon church, and it remains so to this day. Even in Salt Lake City, which probably has the highest non-LDS population in the state, your address is still determined by how far you are from the Temple.

I don't think you could ever have one religion completely dominate a culture in any other state like that.

[jhale667]

I don't think you could ever have one religion completely dominate a culture in any other state like that.

Thank the invisible sky daddy for small favors....

[Nitro Express]

Well, Utah is a special case, considering the first white folks there WERE all members of that particular religion. So they got in early, set up the entire infrastructure of the cities and states, based around the Mormon church, and it remains so to this day. Even in Salt Lake City, which probably has the highest non-LDS population in the state, your address is still determined by how far you are from the Temple.

I don't think you could ever have one religion completely dominate a culture in any other state like that.

Brigham Young was lucky enough to have a large group of people who didn't fight with each other, didn't question his authority and were skilled hard workers. A mutany situation would have killed it off early. The Mormons came into Utah in 1847 following the Donner trail from Ft. Bridger. Most traffic to California went up into Idaho and bypassed the salt flats and alkylin desert due to the dangers of crossing it. In 1849 the gold rush started and people flooded into the west. Then the US government sent Johnston's army to Utah to take things over. What could have been a hot situation turned out to benefit both sides. The Mormons needed money and the army needed food. Then there was the federal crack down on polygamy which was more like the east coast barons coming in wanting to break the grip of the Mormons in Utah.

The thing is Mormons still outnumber non-Mormons so the non-Mormon politicians like McCune would cater to the Mormons. Once the polygamy was gone the mainstream church pretty much became a business owning various business interests. In the old polygamy days they didn't have money so everyone would tithe their time (working on the temple for instance) or giving 10% of what you raised. It was a barter system and the bishop then would give the food to the needy. So tithing originally was a welfare system.

Because the church had little money it was in debt and was issuing bonds. Because of the debt it was decided to make tithing money based. The church paid off it's debts in a short amount of time and had all this surplus money. Then they invested in railroads, utility companies, broadcasting, agriculture. I believe the Mormon church today is the largest private owner of real estate in the US.

So originally Mormonism was communal living under the theocracy and today it's a conglomerante. The main goal of the Mormon church now is the survival of the organization. In another 50 years it will morph into something completely different if it's even still around. The modern church depended heavily on it's members disposable incomes and retirement. They can't run on that system anymore and the younger generation isn't going to tow the line. In other worlds Mormonism will become too much of a burdon and too expensive. It won't adapt to a changing world fast enough. The day you see Mormons lose the political control of Utah is the day it's days are numbered as a church. They are losing too. They have lost metropolitan Salt Lake City which is a Democrat city now.

[FORD]

I think they're hoping to take over Washington DC at the moment, since it's the first time that two Mormons have run for President on a major party. Of course the saner of the two is NOT the one likely to be nominated, and neither is likely to win any of the "deep" red states, outside of Utah (and possibly Idaho)

[BigBadBrian]

I think they're hoping to take over Washington DC at the moment, since it's the first time that two Mormons have run for President on a major party. Of course the saner of the two is NOT the one likely to be nominated, and neither is likely to win any of the "deep" red states, outside of Utah (and possibly Idaho)

Yeah, like your Token Negro in the White House elected on a slogan has any chance of winning the traditionally red states.

[Nitro Express]

I think they're hoping to take over Washington DC at the moment, since it's the first time that two Mormons have run for President on a major party. Of course the saner of the two is NOT the one likely to be nominated, and neither is likely to win any of the "deep" red states, outside of Utah (and possibly Idaho)

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/09/25/utah-undie-run_n_980350.html

They need to take over DC because they are losing Salt Lake City.

[FORD]

Yeah, like your Token Negro in the White House elected on a slogan has any chance of winning the traditionally red states.

Don't kid yourself. When it comes down to a choice between a black man and a "crazy false god believin' Mormon cultist", even half the Klan will be voting for Obama. The other half will probably stay home and not vote at all.

[jhale667]

Unreasonable request alert!

Don't kid yourself.

You may as well tell BigBlandBitch not to breathe...

[Dr. Love]

That's one of the most ridiculous statements I've ever read on this site.

Tide comes in, tide goes out. Sun goes up, Sun goes down. You can't explain that.