Did anyone who saw Page/Plant live in 1995 and/or 1998 miss John Paul Jones?

[Loons The Great]

I didn't. Not even an iota.

[Loons The Great]

I saw The Rolling Stones in 1997. I couldn't have cared less if I tried that Bill Wyman was absent.

[DlocRoth]

I seen it, Loons......

The stage wasn't big enough to notice.......

The bulb was burnin too bright....

[BrownSound1]

Uh yes, I definitely noticed. JPJ was the fucking SHIT...especially considering they had to have a mandolin/keyboardist and a bassist onstage at the same time to do what JPJ did by himself. Oh and on the first tour...a full fuckin' orchestra. :D Hell they just shoulda got Jonesy and his Mellotron.

I understand what reference you are trying to make, but unlike Michael Anthony, John Paul Jones actually wrote some of the music for Led Zeppelin...."Black Dog" and "No Quarter" come to mind, as well as a good portion of the album In Through The Out Door. Comparing the two is not fair to Michael Anthony, because JPJ is a WORLD class musician. How many heavy rock bassists do you know who get offered a full time job to play the organ at Westminster Abbey?

[Loons The Great]

Originally posted by BrownSound1
Uh yes, I definitely noticed. JPJ was the fucking SHIT...especially considering they had to have a mandolin/keyboardist and a bassist onstage at the same time to do what JPJ did by himself. Oh and on the first tour...a full fuckin' orchestra. :D Hell they just shoulda got Jonesy and his Mellotron.

I understand what reference you are trying to make, but unlike Michael Anthony, John Paul Jones actually wrote some of the music for Led Zeppelin...."Black Dog" and "No Quarter" come to mind, as well as a good portion of the album In Through The Out Door. Comparing the two is not fair to Michael Anthony, because JPJ is a WORLD class musician. How many heavy rock bassists do you know who get offered a full time job to play the organ at Westminster Abbey?

Brownsound1, great post!

But when I look back at the shows I saw in '95 and '98...Page/Plant delivered all the LZ I needed...I'm not thinking back,"Awwww man, if only JPJ would've been there..."

[BrownSound1]

Well, I do agree they were great shows, but it would have been even better had JPJ been there, IMHO. I especially felt that way when "No Quarter" was performed on the second tour. That was always a spotlight tune for JPJ when Zeppelin was around, and here's some guy (who was very good, btw) up here doing his thing.

There are some parallels between Led Zep and VH, but some differences too. JPJ and MA are both "quiet" types compared to the others in the band. Both had charismatic frontmen, both had guitar gods. I wouldn't say that AVH is in the same league as John Bonham by any means, but Alex is a damn good drummer. The core of the songwriting were the singer/guitarist in both as well. However, with Van Halen I think it pretty much stopped there, with some interjection from Alex. Led Zeppelin on the other had seemed to me like they mixed ideas from all four. I mean I don't think Jimmy Page was dictating to JPJ what to play, because in all honesty I think JPJ was probably the best overall musician in that band. I do believe that MA was told exactly what to play, even though I also believe that was unnecessary. Maybe I'm wrong...I dunno.

When I look at the MA situation, I really think there is more to this than him selling hot sauce and playing with Hagar. I think this situation has been years in the making, and why it has just now come to a head is beyond me.

[David Lee Rocks]

saw Aerosmith last year without Tom Hamilton, no one seemed to mind

[cadaverdog]

Originally posted by BrownSound1
Uh yes, I definitely noticed. JPJ was the fucking SHIT...especially considering they had to have a mandolin/keyboardist and a bassist onstage at the same time to do what JPJ did by himself. Oh and on the first tour...a full fuckin' orchestra. :D Hell they just shoulda got Jonesy and his Mellotron.

I understand what reference you are trying to make, but unlike Michael Anthony, John Paul Jones actually wrote some of the music for Led Zeppelin...."Black Dog" and "No Quarter" come to mind, as well as a good portion of the album In Through The Out Door. Comparing the two is not fair to Michael Anthony, because JPJ is a WORLD class musician. How many heavy rock bassists do you know who get offered a full time job to play the organ at Westminster Abbey?

I am still a die hard Led Zep fanatic and have never heard the reason
JPJ was not included in the Page/ Plant sessions.
They couldn't call it by that name ,they would have had to call it Page/ Plant/Jones .
Not as catchy as Page/Plant.
Maybe he embarased them when he kissed the dude that played bass while he played keyboard at Live Aid.
In my opinion In Through The Out Door was a major let down to follow up Presence and Physical Graffiti.

[Loons The Great]

Originally posted by BrownSound1
Well, I do agree they were great shows, but it would have been even better had JPJ been there, IMHO. I especially felt that way when "No Quarter" was performed on the second tour. That was always a spotlight tune for JPJ when Zeppelin was around, and here's some guy (who was very good, btw) up here doing his thing.

There are some parallels between Led Zep and VH, but some differences too. JPJ and MA are both "quiet" types compared to the others in the band. Both had charismatic frontmen, both had guitar gods. I wouldn't say that AVH is in the same league as John Bonham by any means, but Alex is a damn good drummer. The core of the songwriting were the singer/guitarist in both as well. However, with Van Halen I think it pretty much stopped there, with some interjection from Alex. Led Zeppelin on the other had seemed to me like they mixed ideas from all four. I mean I don't think Jimmy Page was dictating to JPJ what to play, because in all honesty I think JPJ was probably the best overall musician in that band. I do believe that MA was told exactly what to play, even though I also believe that was unnecessary. Maybe I'm wrong...I dunno.

When I look at the MA situation, I really think there is more to this than him selling hot sauce and playing with Hagar. I think this situation has been years in the making, and why it has just now come to a head is beyond me.

Awesome points here!...there are a LOT of holes in my argument/idea...I'm oversimplifying the whole scenario...but it still make sense to me on some level...this Van Halen tour will hopefully bring it on home somethin' like Page/Plant did...

The '95 gig in St. Louie...I think I was 12th row...Break On Through was incredible...When The Levee Breaks...since they were in St. Louie, they played some of Albert King's,"Born Under A Bad Sign,"...the '98 show...stripped it down...no orchestra...no Cure guitarist...great setlist...

[Hyman Roth]

I missed John Paul Jones so much that I boycotted the entire production. I saw a vhs of the show he played that I missed a few weeks later and couldn't believe how great they sounded.

It was a travesty that Bob had to put his son-in-law in there for Jonesy but the kid sounded pretty damn good.

I was impressed with the young guy on drums too.

The Egyption band I could have skipped. Or they could have done those songs the way they are on the albums (or trade the lot for a good version of "The Song Remains the Same"...).

I regret missing that tour and hope to get the chance to see the three living members together one day.

And and least I learned that lesson in time not to miss Jimmy Page with the Black Crowes when they came through a few years later (and they absolutely tore the place to shreds!).

The End

[Hyman Roth]

^^ true story, actually.

Originally posted by BrownSound1
...JPJ is a WORLD class musician.

Carasolamba..Fool in the Rain...great song writer as well. He was just starting to really carve his niche in the band.

All three of them really were at a certain peak creatively. And Bonham in the studio would have always been perfect no matter how drunk he was at the show.

What eventually became the Firm, Pictures at 11 - with what Jones had commandeered on In Through The Out Door a year earlier; that would have been an interesting direction the band might have been headed.

Sad that Bonham had to die, really. For all the obvious reasons associated with whenever someone dies young, but also for the great music we never got to hear.

[ThrillsNSpills]

Jones has a serious gift for phrasing. Think of the Lemon Song, Carouselambra, Good Times Bad Times, etc. damn

With VH you could put anyone on bass because Ed and Al are a well oiled machine when they play. I don't think Anthony added to the groove of the song much. The fact that he was mixed low doesn't help. His high harmonies were a much stronger contribution.

With JPJ, he would do interesting things in the context of the song. If you listen to the bass part on the riff during the Ocean, he doesn't play the riff exactly like Page. Sublte stuff like that make ALL the difference.
Most bass players would have just played the exact same riff.

I saw Page Plant in 95 and I missed the chemistry of the original band. It was still a great show. I was surprised by Plant's range, but remember all we had live was Song Remains the Same which to this day I don't know why they released that when they had so many stronger live performances .

[tajmahal]

Page/Plant played a Cure song because the keyboardist was an ex-Cure member.

[Matt White]

LIsten to "NOSUMI BLUES" off of JPJ's ZOOMA......

JOHN PAUL was a HUGE part of the ZEPPELIN sound...more than anybody realizes......

When I saw PAGE & PLANT on both tours...I realized I wasn't seeing LED ZEPPELIN...but there was flashes of the old HAMMER OF THE GODS from time to time......

[EAT MY ASSHOLE]

Page and Plant not even contacting JPJ to let him know is the most classless, dispicable act the two ever pulled to their ex-bandmate and the most tactless and stupid thing they ever did to their fans. Fuck them and the air they breathe.

MA, that's life. No comparison.