Why Do You Think Ed Turned Into Such A Pussy in 1985?

[letsrock]

Those are the Edtards saying that and the Davetards said the opposite


Nowadays I think even the Edtards have a tough time justifying Ed's behavior over the last 15 years

Exactly. This was just a dysfuntional band.

[Terry]

I see your point to an extent, and I'm sure that DLR fucked with Ed's head to some degree.

But the problem was that Roth was a workaholic, and Ed was a rampant ALCOHOLIC.

The two just didn't mix. Perhaps if Ed was sober he would have been in a better position to deal with Dave's work ethic, grandstanding, and (possibly) "abusive" behavior.

Maybe DLR was just showing Ed some "tough love" and the boy couldn't handle it....opting instead to go cry on Valerie's shoulder about how "mean" David was.

Which of course ultimately led to Ed finding a "kinder, gentler" frontman in the form of one Samuel Roy Hagar.

We all know what happened from there....

Think you hit the nail on the head with the work ethic of Roth vs. Ed.

If you look at what Roth was up to between the end of the 1984 tour and the EEAS record in the early summer of 1986, he recorded, released and promoted a solo album, made attempts to get a movie made and put a new band and album together from scratch.

As opposed to what the rest of Van Halen did from the end of the 1984 tour and the release of 5150 in the spring of 1986, which was hire a new singer and put out an album that already had tunes demoed when Roth was still in the band.

[D-RO']

Valerie is the answer. When you let the pussy control you, you become a pussy. She was looking for a ship to hijack from the start when she was hunting for Roth's cock only to be snubbed and settling for her Dutch doppelganger. She was the one spewing anti-Dave shit in Ed’s ear and encouraging him to pursue the bad ideas that Templeman and DLR vetoed repeatedly. The result is Eddie Van Halen, restrained genius breaking the chains to pursue more "profound music" (morbid music) and "artistic heights" (keyboards). The stadium touring idea could have easily been another Val idea so he could be a family man.

[SNIPER]

I blame over production and Sammy of course. I think they thought the raw sound was not perfect and outdated when that was the most important key to the VH sound. A lot of post Roth guitar riffs would have been okay had Eddie recorded and played them like he was playing live, had DLR, turned off the compression suck button, and did not have that stupid delay after every note.

Also by 1985 Eddie had used up his stash of riffs that he had since 74 when he was hungry.

Just my thoughts that I have had 20+years.

[Nitro Express]

A manager has a lot to do with how a band operates. In 1985 Van Halen had new management and a new singer. Roth pretty much was the alpha dog in classic Van Halen. Roth controlled everyone and had management's ear. Once Dave was out and Ted Templeman went with Dave, Eddie became the new alpha dog and his brother sided with Ed. Sammy was just there to make money and stroke his image. Sam is a ballad guy and has horrible taste. The only thing that kept Van Hagar going was Mike, Ed, and Al were excellent musicians and even if the songs were about love walking in and aliens, there was some good guitar, bass, and drum work but Sam's piss tainted it all.

[Va Beach VH Fan]

Oh, I place the vast majority of the blame on Hagar. I know that may sound like the easy route, but hear me out, dammit...

I think 5150 and to a lesser extent OU812 were successful based on past successes. Sure, they had "hits", but they were lollipop hits.... As they went on, the fans got more and more turned off, and the sales reflected that, although even with Balance, they sold 3 million, which ain't chump change....

Gone were the raw riffs and the blazing solos. Gone were the tremendous lyrics, replaced by juvenile and tired ones. HORRIBLE lyrics.

And as a direct result, their entire attitude changed. The energy was gone. The edge was gone. It was replaced by an entirely lackadaisical, silly, goofy group that no longer felt it had the need to have a work ethic to make a great rock album. And because of that, all you got during the Hagar era was pop album after pop album.

So of course now, with Dave back in the fold, that he'll renew that work ethic and make a Van Halen album more suited towards the Roth era than the Hagar era.....

[PETE'S BROTHER]

Oh, I place the vast majority of the blame on Hagar. I know that may sound like the easy route, but hear me out, dammit...

I think 5150 and to a lesser extent OU812 were successful based on past successes. Sure, they had "hits", but they were lollipop hits.... As they went on, the fans got more and more turned off, and the sales reflected that, although even with Balance, they sold 3 million, which ain't chump change....

Gone were the raw riffs and the blazing solos. Gone were the tremendous lyrics, replaced by juvenile and tired ones. HORRIBLE lyrics.

And as a direct result, their entire attitude changed. The energy was gone. The edge was gone. It was replaced by an entirely lackadaisical, silly, goofy group that no longer felt it had the need to have a work ethic to make a great rock album. And because of that, all you got during the Hagar era was pop album after pop album.

So of course now, with Dave back in the fold, that he'll renew that work ethic and make a Van Halen album more suited towards the Roth era than the Hagar era.....

and that stupid 3-way train march across the stage was the image of "edge gone bad".

[Nitro Express]

Oh, I place the vast majority of the blame on Hagar. I know that may sound like the easy route, but hear me out, dammit...

I think 5150 and to a lesser extent OU812 were successful based on past successes. Sure, they had "hits", but they were lollipop hits.... As they went on, the fans got more and more turned off, and the sales reflected that, although even with Balance, they sold 3 million, which ain't chump change....

Gone were the raw riffs and the blazing solos. Gone were the tremendous lyrics, replaced by juvenile and tired ones. HORRIBLE lyrics.

And as a direct result, their entire attitude changed. The energy was gone. The edge was gone. It was replaced by an entirely lackadaisical, silly, goofy group that no longer felt it had the need to have a work ethic to make a great rock album. And because of that, all you got during the Hagar era was pop album after pop album.

So of course now, with Dave back in the fold, that he'll renew that work ethic and make a Van Halen album more suited towards the Roth era than the Hagar era.....

I think you are right. Sammy Hagar is a subpar artist but a very good businessman and sales man. Amazingly he has made money with every venture he's been involved in. I mean he can make money. Van Hagars big songs were commercial jingles. Right Now is a horrible song but it make lots of money. You always heard their stuff on television programs and on commercials. The band became goofy instead of the out to dominate the world rock pirates they were.

[Nitro Express]

I got busted in 2nd grade for writing naughty poems about our substitute teacher. The girl that sat next to me snitched me out and I got in real big trouble. The school called my mom and I remember being grilled on where I learned about sucking this and that. I didn't learn it, I intuitively knew I wanted to do those things with her. LOL! Anyways may poems in second grade were about on par with Hagar's lyrics. Horny grade school stuff. I still remember that tight ass and big tits on that substitute teacher! Damn! I still want to do all those things. LOL!

[VHscraps]

and that stupid 3-way train march across the stage was the image of "edge gone bad".

damn right - that made me cringe. Some phonies like Bon Jovi might lay that on you, but the Mighty Van Halen?? My first thought when I saw that was 'they're fuckin rippin off ZZ Top's video' anyway. Was it Sharp Dressed Man? Typical Hagar idea probably, trying to 'act' the party guy.

But, why did they wimp out? I remember reading the first Rolling Stone cover story on VH after Hagar joined - it is just as others have been saying - the journo, David Fricke, wrote: "the surprising fact is that in Van Halen David Lee Roth was generalissimo in music matters" - Ed admitted it. DLR filtered ideas ideas, and helped weed out the duff stuff.

Why else would he have 10 albums ready to go? He needs someone to lend an outside ear and exercise some judgement - but he doesn't trust anyone anymore I reckon.

[Trudy Green]

Why else would he have 10 albums ready to go? He needs someone to lend an outside ear and exercise some judgement - but he doesn't trust anyone anymore I reckon.

Agree 100%

[ace diamond]

Too many years riffing on Elton John records during his youth or one too many late nights hanging out with Lukathur and those other fags in Toto?

sammy hagar

[Igosplut]

Anybody else notice this thread was dredged up from the dead?

[hambon4lif]

Anybody else notice this thread was dredged up from the dead?

Well...when you cunsider who dredged it up...it still is!

[delta5150]

He started turning into a pussy before 1985, I'd say 1981-1982