I Figured Out A Way To Get Mike Back In The Band

[TJMKID]

Somewhere in here there is a thread from when this all started in which I said he was going to be blowing minds. His lackluster stage presence is the only thing holding him back right now, imo.

The main thing that's holding back Wolfie is his glaring lack of musical compositions ---- he hasn't produced one single snippet of original music that we can judge harshly on it's own merits.

Read the liner notes to ADKOT and it says all music written by "Roth/Van Halen" ---- that sounds like code for ---- "My Daddy wrote all my bass lines for me".

[DLR Bridge]

The main thing that's holding back Wolfie is his glaring lack of musical compositions ---- he hasn't produced one single snippet of original music that we can judge harshly on it's own merits.

Read the liner notes to ADKOT and it says all music written by "Roth/Van Halen" ---- that sounds like code for ---- "My Daddy wrote all my bass lines for me".

No way. He's clearly guiding his own bass lines. He pulls of some tasty Entwhistle runs in Blood & Fire. He's clearly cutting it up on Chinatown. The crazy bass with Wah that leads in Honeybabysweetiedoll leaves open the possibility that it's his riff and Dad is playing along. For someone who took on the role of playing bass in this band, compositions are not part of the job requirement. In most cases, that would be gravy. Just like most managers don't expect their catchers to knock the cover off the ball. Their main contribution comes from behind the plate.

[TJMKID]

I think that Dave probably would say that too. That he would have preferred having Mike to do a proper final reunion with. What I don't understand though is why he didn't push for that when he and EVH were discussing details back in '06ish? Basically, Ed bent Dave over and said "We're doing this with my son" whether you like it or not. Take it or leave it. Ed is a controlling little fucker though, as you say. I think it's pretty obvious too, after seeing some decisions he's made through the years. Hell, when Mike wanted to do a few gigs on the Sam & Dave tour in '02, Ed told him "As long as you don't play with Roth." What kind of bullshit is that? Mike already had his permission, why add that? It was uncalled for. Seems to me that Ed is a sensitive person, and he got his little feelings hurt when Mike was going out and enjoying himself playing alongside Hagar. Many around here think Mike cut his own throat by doing so, not sure that I could agree.

Mike was always expendable to Ed ---- if Ed/Al was willing to spend many years calling Dave a "disease" (as in Lead Singer Disease) and repeatedly tell the fans they only hired Dave because he had a PA system ---- then what do you expect Eddie and Alex are going to think of Mike's worthiness to the band? VERY LITTLE.

As you said ---- Mike teaming up with Spamborita and calling themselves "The Other Half" was the lid on the coffin for Mike's tenure in VH. That REALLY pissed off the sisters. There's also that nagging rumor that Mike blew off the funeral for Mrs. Eugenia Van Halen and if it's true --- then that certainly doesn't make him more likable in Van Halen country.

EVH has a very simple employment contract for anyone whose last name isn't Van Halen ---- you can work for me ONLY --- there will be NO side projects for you --- sometimes you will just sit around on your ass with nothing to do for YEARS while I live out of a bottle. Those are MY RULES ---- take it or leave it.

[TJMKID]

Look at the interviews they've provided us... No Wolfgang present. I think Wolfgang is content for now staying in the shadows of his family legacy. Even let Dave have the spotlight for things the kid may have created in the background. It is his Dad's life... But I can't be so bold nor naive to think Wolfgang had no creative compositional contribution... the leap from 2004 is more than the 3 old guys had in them... if you follow the creative historical progression...

There's a Joker in the deck...

Interesting theory ---- but you're forgetting about "Me Wise Magic" and "Cant Get This Stuff No More". Those 2 songs are just as good as anything on ADKOT and Wolfie was still slurpin' on Valerie's teets when they came out.

The Joker in the deck is Dave ---- he brings out the aggressive side of Eddie ---- and Wolfie is just along for the ride. Bring back Spammy and they'd be putting out "Up for Breakfast 2" ---- and Wolfie's contributions would be minimal as well.

[TJMKID]

No way. He's clearly guiding his own bass lines. He pulls of some tasty Entwhistle runs in Blood & Fire. He's clearly cutting it up on Chinatown. The crazy bass with Wah that leads in Honeybabysweetiedoll leaves open the possibility that it's his riff and Dad is playing along. For someone who took on the role of playing bass in this band, compositions are not part of the job requirement. In most cases, that would be gravy. Just like most managers don't expect their catchers to knock the cover off the ball. Their main contribution comes from behind the plate.

I wanna see the kid release just one teeny weeny nugget of original music that he composed all by himself before we crown his ass.

His Daddy had 50+ mind-blowing original rock songs circulating on demo tapes by the time he was 21 ---- and with today's social media channels, Wolfie can't even release one tiny snippet of him noodling on his bass and producing a cool little tune that he wrote?

The jury is still out on Wolfgang ---- and a few tasty bass runs in ADKOT is not that convincing.

[Never was]

But if he never produces any composition he will match Anthonys 30 years which is nothing. Why crown Anthony other than nostalgia?

Imagine Anthony trying to play Chinatown

Keep the better bass better and jerkoff to your 1978 poster if you feel nostalgic.

[DLR Bridge]

My point is, perhaps he doesn't write music. Mike didn't and was solid. Just because his last name is Van Halen, doesn't mean he was born with riff and song writing abilities. We'll hear something original from him someday, and when that day comes, it's gonna get the hell judged out of it. Do you really think Frank Sinatra Jr. ever actually had a chance of stepping outside his Dad's spotlight and shining in his own? It can't be easy being the kid of an icon.

[TJMKID]

My point is, perhaps he doesn't write music. Mike didn't and was solid. Just because his last name is Van Halen, doesn't mean he was born with riff and song writing abilities. We'll hear something original from him someday, and when that day comes, it's gonna get the hell judged out of it. Do you really think Frank Sinatra Jr. ever actually had a chance of stepping outside his Dad's spotlight and shining in his own? It can't be easy being the kid of an icon.

It's definitely not being easy the kid of an icon ---- but I'm getting a wee bit perturbed about all this talk of Wolfie being the new leader of the Mighty Van Halen as he's going to carry it forward for another generation. That's very presumptious for a 21-yr. old fella who hasn't shown he can compose his own music yet.

Besides, I think carrying on the band with the name "Van Halen" after Dave, Eddie, and Alex are fully retired or dead is downright offensive. How would people like it if Jason Bonham hired a singer who looks and sounds like a young Robert Plant and a young guitarist who looks and sounds like Jimmy Page and called the band "Led Zeppelin" ?? There would be riots in the streets. Just because Wolf came from a lucky set of loins doesn't give him indisputable rights to carry on the band name "Van Halen" and assume the fans are going to be cool with that. I certainly won't be.

Let's not crown his ass yet ---- let him show his real talents for making music if he has any ---- and let's hope he doesnt offend a lot of people by milking the brand name "Van Halen" for every penny after his Daddy and Dave are long gone. If he can prove his mettle, I will be cheering for the guy in whatever endeavor he chooses.

[TJMKID]

But if he never produces any composition he will match Anthonys 30 years which is nothing. Why crown Anthony other than nostalgia?

Imagine Anthony trying to play Chinatown

Keep the better bass better and jerkoff to your 1978 poster if you feel nostalgic.

The only thing your post proves is that Wolfie is a good technical bass player ---- and I've seen 14 yr. old bassists on YouTube with more technical skill than Wolfie ---- so why not hire them?

Try to think rationally instead of spewing the party line of the "Wolfgang Ballsack Nuzzlers Society".

[Never was]

OK saying wolfie MAY produce in the future more than the nothing produced is nuzzling his sac, ok thats rational.

So the argument for Anthony other than nostagia was????????

Enjoy your poster and dont forget the tissues.

[DLR Bridge]

You're taking the "band leader" comments a bit too literal. The remark is about his present role aside from just playing bass. Read Ed's Esquire interview again. The kid is, for all intense and purposes, guiding the live set song selection and pointing out to his Pa & Uncle Al what they need to brush up on. As far as the future goes, my guess is he will leave the nest. The nest will be the sole legacy of the founding fathers and the kid, young man rather, will start anew. Just a guess here.

I like the name he had for his band with his high school friends. Die Sheiss. German for 'the shit'

[fourthcoming]

Seriously, when are people going to realize for better or for worse....this is the way it's going to be. NOTHING is going to change. VAN HALEN is David Lee Roth, Edward Van Halen, Alex Van Halen, Wolfgang Van Halen. End this thread already please!!!

[ZahZoo]

Interesting theory ---- but you're forgetting about "Me Wise Magic" and "Cant Get This Stuff No More". Those 2 songs are just as good as anything on ADKOT and Wolfie was still slurpin' on Valerie's teets when they came out.

The Joker in the deck is Dave ---- he brings out the aggressive side of Eddie ---- and Wolfie is just along for the ride. Bring back Spammy and they'd be putting out "Up for Breakfast 2" ---- and Wolfie's contributions would be minimal as well.

I disagree that the Dave is the Joker in the deck. A key element to compositional standards for Van Halen... yes... but then even Dave's creative history wasn't heading anywhere near ADKOT. Follow the trail...

In 96, when Dave did MWM & CGTSNM with VH... with Michael on bass. Both songs were unused compositions that Ed, Al & Mike had laying around 5150. Dave struggled and had to work his ass off to produce those vocals. The magic, of course was bringing the unique vocal melodies and structure that only Dave can produce... then layering it on Van Halen music. To my ears... MWM & CGTSNM are minor league cuts compared to anything on ADKOT.

Prior... Dave was in his Vegas show band era. Nuff sadly said...

In 98 Dave put out DLR Band. A good solo effort but not anywhere in the same league as ADKOT musically nor vocally.

Followed by Diamond Dave 5 years later in 2003... an assembly of cover tunes, Vegas leftovers and one leftover from DLR Band.

Then 9 years pass... and boom the ADKOT galaxy is born. Yes, Dave was a critical contributor in the lyrical compositions and rewrites for old stuff. He clearly brought his unique melodic sense to the singing aspects... But you can't say the underlying musical melodies, riffs and structures are all Dave.

My point is there was nothing pointing toward this new album coming from Dave, Ed or Al based on what they were producing leading up to this the past 15 years. There's no indication of a natural progression. But throw in a motivated young man with clearly musical gifts... then we get our asses kicked. Thus the Joker or Wild Card in the old deck...

[TJMKID]

You're taking the "band leader" comments a bit too literal. The remark is about his present role aside from just playing bass. Read Ed's Esquire interview again. The kid is, for all intense and purposes, guiding the live set song selection and pointing out to his Pa & Uncle Al what they need to brush up on. As far as the future goes, my guess is he will leave the nest. The nest will be the sole legacy of the founding fathers and the kid, young man rather, will start anew. Just a guess here.

I'm just saying some people need to tone down the rhetoric about "Wolf is the future King of Van Halen". He's got a long row to hoe to earn that title --- and a few bass runs in ADKOT is just one little baby step in that direction (if he wrote those bass lines).

For my money --- if he can keep his Pops on the straight and narrow for the rest of this 2012-2014? tour and perhaps even another album --- he's fulfilling his most useful purpose to the VH fanbase.

[TJMKID]

My point is there was nothing pointing toward this new album coming from Dave, Ed or Al based on what they were producing leading up to this the past 15 years. There's no indication of a natural progression. But throw in a motivated young man with clearly musical gifts... then we get our asses kicked. Thus the Joker or Wild Card in the old deck...

I'm just not buying your premise that Wolfie is all that "motivated" or has "clear musical gifts". I'm still giving Eddie and Dave 99% of the credit for ADKOT being a great album. Dave actually did the most work because he came up with new lyrics to the old demos.

The kid has a natural ability to play well on a technical level --- but that's not a musical gift. Reference my earlier statement about YouTube kiddies playing bass and guitar. A true musical gift is someone who has catchy and timeless musical compositions and lyrics flowing out of him like a water fountain and the instrument or voice is the vehicle to deliver that creativity. Dave and Eddie proved they had that gift by the mid-70's. Playing a few tasty bass runs in ADKOT is not enough proof for me that Wolfie inherited "the gift".

As far as being motivated, I'm not that impressed by a supposed musical prodigy barking orders at soundcheck. EVH and AVH are old farts and need reminded about technical aspects of songs they wrote 35 years ago. It happens to a lot of people getting close to 60. Go watch a soundcheck for Aerosmith or The Who or anyone of similar age and you'll see LOTS of mistakes based on foggy memories.

In his days off, Wolfie spends his time hanging with his chick and watching a lot of hockey. Nothing wrong with that, but his Pops and uncle and Dave at that age seem to have the "fire in the belly" and were always thinking and playing music. I don't see that same burning desire in Wolf. He needs to put down the Twitter phone and start noodling on his bass late into the night and producing stuff that makes people's jaws drop.