Ed, Gene Simmons and Dave's book

[FIRELITE]

This story seems very unlikely to me. Ed ws frustrated at being just a guitarist and wanting to have more control and he sure wouldn't get that by joining someone else's band. Plus, Ed has always critisised KISS for their lack of musicality. I can't see him asking to join them. I don't believe Gene.

[DLR_EngineRoom]

Originally posted by FIRELITE
This story seems very unlikely to me. Ed ws frustrated at being just a guitarist and wanting to have more control and he sure wouldn't get that by joining someone else's band. Plus, Ed has always critisised KISS for their lack of musicality. I can't see him asking to join them. I don't believe Gene.

Ed's f***kin' drunk when he makes his major decisions! Hellloooo? Can you spell H-A-G-A-R?? Ed admitted it himself that he visited Gene and Paul regarding joining KISS, no one disputes that! WTF? Your opinion vs. both Gene AND Ed's testimony......hmmm....tough decision...W/E!

[Mezro]

Originally posted by DLR_EngineRoom
and both Gene and Paul both felt that Eric Carr was the perfect drummer for KISS.

And he was...and he was....

Mezro...why couldn't Mark St. John bite it instead of Eric...

[Va Beach VH Fan]

While not totally related to this story, I always find it interesting to note that while Gene is always credited for "discovering" Van Halen, his efforts went for not, the band did not get signed on their trip to New York....

For those who haven't seen the "Early Years" DVD, this is one of the features...

Maybe when I take my son to see KISS Sunday, I'll ask him about it.... { Yeah, like I'm going to fork over 2G's to meet the band }.....

[Terry]

Originally posted by 5150Clown
Interesting. You know, wheather this is true or not...i don't know, but if it was, it would not suprise me. Ed is a strange man. He seems to simplify it all in interviews (like the victim that only wants to make music) but it seems that everyone around him that works with him can't stand him for a minute....only big sister.

Gene wouldn't have turned down Ed. If he did...he probably was just thinking about the bigger picture of things. Kiss was going down and who could replace ACE? Ed would have been the winning formula. But if Gene turned down Ed is because he saw Ed as someone that would probably outgrow the band in 2 seconds, or would not conform to a "gun for hire" state replacing Ace.

No shit. Ed loves to play the hapless victim, but his actions and his own words betray that facade.

Ed in KISS may sound good to some on paper, but it's just as well it didn't happen. Ed's capable of playing punchy, simple blues/rock solos, the kind that suit KISS the best and which Frehley accelerated at (see Running With The Devil, Jamie's Crying, etc.), but it's not something he does a lot of or would be comfortable doing exclusively.

Sounds like Ed was one of a half dozen people who sat in for Ace in the studio from time to time when Ace didn't show up, and Gene may well have wanted Ed and Alex to join the band in the late 70s, when Peter and Ace were regularly threatening to leave the group. But by 1981 KISS were in a free fall in the US while Halen were tearing up arenas. As much as Ed later said he wanted to leave in 1981, he apparently didn't mind playing sold out tours with Dave in the band too much.

Personally, I think Ed's story about wanting to leave in 1981 was all bullshit anyway. Just something he threw out there after Dave left as a way to try and upstage Roth, since Roth was the one who quit the band. "Yeah, Dave quit, but I wanted to quit first!"

Pussy.

[Terry]

Originally posted by DLR_EngineRoom
Ultimate Band Lineup:

David Lee Roth - Vocals
Gene Simmons - Bass
Paul Stanley - Rhythm Guitar
Eddie Van Halen - Lead Guitar
Tommy Lee - Drums

David Lee Roth - vocals

John Entwistle - Bass

Keith Richards - Rhythm Guitar

Eddie Van Halen - Lead Guitar

Neil Peart - Drums

[thefive]

Originally posted by DLR_EngineRoom
Ed's f***kin' drunk when he makes his major decisions! Hellloooo? Can you spell H-A-G-A-R?? Ed admitted it himself that he visited Gene and Paul regarding joining KISS, no one disputes that! WTF? Your opinion vs. both Gene AND Ed's testimony......hmmm....tough decision...W/E!

But did Ed ever admit asking if he could join kiss?

[thefive]

I believe Dave's story. I do not know why Dave would lie about the very beginning of Van Halen. Why would Dave tell the story about him going down to see KISS and there would be no ticket for him? There is no reason for Dave to tell that story. Why would Dave tell the story about Gene trying to steal Eddie in the very beginning? I see no motive on Dave's part.

[Big Troubles]

Yeah Id like to hear Ed's version of that story Gene tells. See, generally when people tell a story they make themselves the King or Queen of the story. The other people involved always play second fiddle. Thats what makes me think it was Gene trying to take Ed from VH when Ace left. I also think Ed was wise for saying "lick me". Or well Im sure he said "No thank you"

good find though Mez

[tobinentinc]

I deff believes Dave's side in his book because it's textbook Simmons. But I do also partly believes Gene's side on this 81 thing, and him turing Eddie down. Edward Van Halen, is not a great person, and he wouldn't have gotten along great with the rest of KISS. I would have liked to see Ed play with KISS ONCE and only ONCE.

[thefive]

I dont believe Gene at all. He just seems to be a bullshitter. IMO.
I hate greedy people too. I hate greed.

[TwoFoolsAMinute]

The story in Crazy From the Heat is that the reason for Gene's production of their demo was to woo Ed over to KISS. This is not during the recording of Creatures of the Night. That was well before. Regardless of what Gene says about what happened during that time, we know Gene did in fact produce demos for Van Halen in 1976. And, therefore we know that during this earlier time period Gene did have access to Edward. And Gene has said nothing about what transpired back then. In other words, neither of these stories conflicts with the other, and therefore, the question was not answered.

[ROTHandRoll]

Ed's too drunk to remember anything, and if he does sober up his brain cells are already lost and irreplaceable (as evidenced by the 3 new tunes). Gene and Paul would have kicked his ass out after a short while since Ed would have been a carbon copy of Ace in the distillery department. Props to Dave for putting up w/ Ed's bullshit over the many years. Dave truly is the greater guy.

[5150Clown]

Gene could have been interested in Ed in the early years (before VH1), but not after that. Gene & Paul are control freaks and they need sheep as bandmates.

[Figs]

Originally posted by 5150Clown
Gene could have been interested in Ed in the early years (before VH1), but not after that. Gene & Paul are control freaks and they need sheep as bandmates.

Plus I can't imagine that Ed wouldn't ask to play some VH songs in concert and they would probably agree to maybe one song.

Originally posted by DLR_EngineRoom
whatever hater....the truth is that Gene didn't want Ed (and Al, the deal was that both would come aboard) to be separated from Dave, since Gene loved/loves the original line up. The other reason Gene said no was because it would have meant kicking Eric Carr out of the band, and both Gene and Paul both felt that Eric Carr was the perfect drummer for KISS.

The Alex factor has got to be the biggest reason this didn't happen. Alex goes wherever Ed goes.