Van Halen Tape Vault Info

[twonabomber]

I wonder if Warner Brothers has something to do with it. Maybe EVH doesn't want them to profit from his band again.

Maybe WB has right of first refusal to release material recorded between certain dates. Who knows.

[ELVIS]

or anything from the 1984 sessions which may well have had Eddie himself on bass.

That's a bunch of bullshit...

[tojoro]

How large of a role do you suppose Al plays in all of this? Especially in the past decade, where Ed was obviously at his lowest?

I agree with folks here concerning the brother's treatment of Mike...he was a part of the six-pack, he contributed. Attempting to re-write history, (ala the Osbournes), is assuming your fans are stupid.

Something they have to consider is that their fans aren't getting any younger, and they are losing them to Father Time at a steady pace...By fans, I mean those of us who were in Junior High or older when these guys hit...before their albums were available on CD.

I don't mean to discount the younger fans, here, I just believe those of us in our forties or older have a larger stake in this...a greater interest, if you will.

A great many bands are so fucking vain about their live or demo material, when they should realize the fans just aren't that picky.

We realize that the record companies had you recording, then touring constantly in the seventies and eighties...we know you were fucked up on coke, and/or smack and/or booze. It's history, plain and simple...it's also live, which comes with the understanding that someone could have an off night with their sound or voice...we aren't that stupid.

Gene may be a whore, but he's a smart fucker. He went with the premise of: "If you build it. they will come.", and they did! In fookin' droves, and everyone reaped the benefits, band, fans and the label.

Where the fuck is any footage of the Allman Brothers Band while Duane and Berry will still here? Bill Graham considered them the "House Band" at the Fillmore East, so you know he had to have filmed at least one show from their heyday...and Duane has been gone over four decades now.

Aerosmith? Yes, they suck now, but there's really nothing circa Debut thru Rocks era? Although they did hook us up with some nuggets on Pandora's Box, and the Texas Jam '78, but even that show has yet to be re-released on DVD.

Sabbath? I understand the Ozzy years is something of a sticky situation, but I thought there would have been something after Ronnie passed.

These days, everyone has their own management and gaggle of lawyers, they travel on seperate buses and are assigned their own dressing rooms.

The only people any vault material matters to is the fans, yet there's been less than a handful of bands who bother to acknowledge that.
Sucks...

~T.

[DLR Bridge]

Head of the nail? Meet the hammer. Well put!

[ZahZoo]

Maybe WB has right of first refusal to release material recorded between certain dates. Who knows.

From what has been said by WB is they own distribution of the full "released" catalog through Best of Both Worlds which was released in July 2004. Given Ed built 5150 and took up recording at home in 1984 without the record company paying for studio time then any unfinished or unreleased material recorded were Van Halen's and not under WB control. There wasn't that much leftovers prior to 1984 that WB may have had control of...

From what I recall is WB had a contract option for 1 more release from VH after III. About a third of an album was put together with Cherone before he was fired in 1999. They attempted working with Dave a few times in 2000 but then Ed went through his cancer and divorce period in 2002. Then ED & Al made peace with Hagar and they were attempting to do an album but Ed was such a mess he couldn't produce more than 3 songs over months of attempts... so they repackaged another greatest hit and added those 3 crap songs as bonus material... Ed & Al were still under the delusion they couldn't tour without new material back then...

I never heard or read anything official from WB regarding their contractual rights to any live recordings and films shot between 78-04. Clearly there's evidence of many pro-shot and recorded shows during this time. Problem with those though is there were other production companies involved in the filming and recording beyond VH and WB... so copyrights and ownership become murky with multiple entities involved. That's a real mess unless it was financed and fully owned by the band or WB. Even then... both VH & WB probably had clauses for release quality and distribution to protect from anyone "officially" releasing anything.

Bottom line... I believe the vaults sit locked for a long time. Not so much on Ed & Al hording it due to quality... hoarding it to prevent Mike, Dave, Sam or Cherone a paycheck... I suspect a lot of it is tied up in murky legal contracts and distribution deals that no one wants to pay $$millions$$ to lawyers to sort out for our sake...

[chuckjitsu]

Other than being Ed's brother, wtf did Al do as far as "contributing" back in the day (or to this day)? MA gets bagged on for his alleged lack of contribution, but shouldn't Al be considered a coattail rider as well based on the standards used to judge MA? Was Mike ever even asked or encouraged to offer music/ideas?

To me, if Ed, Al & Dave can climb/conquer the Mt. Everest sized animus they felt toward each other, then relatively speaking, patching up with Mike should be the equivalent of a casual hike up a gently rolling hill.

[DLR Bridge]

Other than being Ed's brother, wtf did Al do as far as "contributing" back in the day (or to this day)?

A fair question, however, way way way back in the day (as per the VH Early Years documentary) the band was referred to as "Alex's band". I'd say that sort of clout he had in the early days must have him pretty well grand fathered into to the stock of it all.

[ZahZoo]

I'll give non-musicians the benefit of the doubt... But what makes you guys think Bass players and Drummers don't compose their musical parts of songs?? WTF?

[lesfunk]

Probably cuz most are guitarists round here

[DLR Bridge]

I'll give non-musicians the benefit of the doubt... But what makes you guys think Bass players and Drummers don't compose their musical parts of songs?? WTF?

In many cases, but certainly not all, they do compose their parts for songs that were melodically and lyrically written by others. In the case of this band, I'd say the key writers are Dave and Ed. Al, Mike & Wolf are/were contributors in an accompaniment sense. However marvelous Al's playing is on Outta Love, I still cuntsider it a Dave and Ed composition. That's just my opinion, though. I have no idea how these things are officially labeled. Look at all of the Lennon/McCartney collaborations that give zero credit to the drummer and other guitarist of the band.

[Zing!]

Or McCartney/Lennon, since we're talking about rearranged songwriting credits (right Yoko?)

[ZahZoo]

Probably cuz most are guitarists round here

I'm a guitarist... but having worked years and developing compositions with others and especially good creative drummers there's a lot that goes into creating the right beat not only for the guitar rhythm, bass line but also the vocal melodies. Same thing with bass.

It all looks simple when performed by professionals... but it's no trivial thing to develop a truly original piece from top to bottom. Especially so with complex timing signatures and non traditional song structures such as many of Van Halen's classic hits.

[Hardrock69]

I realized something last night.

Ed's treatment of Mike has been of the sort, that something HAD to have happened to make Ed hate Mikey like no tomorrow.

I know what it is.....Mikey probably screwed Val at some point in the late 80s......

Val admits in her autobiography that she was the first one to fuck someone outside her marriage. She never identified who it was.

But Ed's hatred of Mike is a good indicator it was for a reason of that magnitude.

Perhaps Spambot was involved somehow.

Perhaps Mikey ass-raped Val while she was blowing the Ched Monkey.

That would easily explain Ed's hatred of those two.

[PETE'S BROTHER]

I realized something last night.

Ed's treatment of Mike has been of the sort, that something HAD to have happened to make Ed hate Mikey like no tomorrow.

I know what it is.....Mikey probably screwed Val at some point in the late 80s......

Val admits in her autobiography that she was the first one to fuck someone outside her marriage. She never identified who it was.

But Ed's hatred of Mike is a good indicator it was for a reason of that magnitude.

Perhaps Spambot was involved somehow.

Perhaps Mikey ass-raped Val while she was blowing the Ched Monkey.

That would easily explain Ed's hatred of those two.

i was told mike anthony pissed ed off during the death of ed's mom

[Nickdfresh]

The Zep DVD still blows my mind, even now. Makes me wish Oakland would get even half that effort...

I think the double-CD set How The West Was Won was better IMHO. The linear notes clearly state that Page found these live recordings he had no idea, or had forgotten, existed for the album while looking for video footage. I wonder how much Ed remembers and from when?