Rolling Stone - Wolf & Ed

[ZahZoo]

The Van Halen’s were not nostalgic. They were into what the current thing they were into was. They were never concerned about what the fans wanted and why they got away with that attitude is they were cool enough and talented enough they sucked people into their world. They didn’t have to do all this market research and try and figure out what the fans wanted. They did their thing and the fans were addicted enough to them they could get away with doing things their way.

To be perfectly blunt... they weren't smart enough to know what market research was or how to go about doing it. They were kids who barely graduated high school immersed in the 70's Southern California party scene... they were lucky and talented enough musically to find a way to make enough money to fuel their alcohol and drug use, get laid and never have to work a real job in their life... the lucky part made them millionaires... not their business smarts.

"Their way"... was a short step up from being homeless street bums. Ed almost went full circle if look at him 2004-2006 for the shape and mental hole he dug himself into...

[Nitro Express]

To be perfectly blunt... they weren't smart enough to know what market research was or how to go about doing it. They were kids who barely graduated high school immersed in the 70's Southern California party scene... they were lucky and talented enough musically to find a way to make enough money to fuel their alcohol and drug use, get laid and never have to work a real job in their life... the lucky part made them millionaires... not their business smarts.

"Their way"... was a short step up from being homeless street bums. Ed almost went full circle if look at him 2004-2006 for the shape and mental hole he dug himself into...

Hell. They weren’t even smart enough to know don’t sign the first contract you are given.

[Nitro Express]

We got to see the Side Show Bob Smoking Loon wino Ed for one simple reason. His family were so desperate to get him sober before he killed himself that they figured getting him out on a tour would force him to be responsible because Ed took his profession serious but at home he devolved into a fucked up bum. They used Wolfgang to bait Ed out on tour, luckily the kid could play and sing well enough to fill in for Mike. But it didn’t work. The public got to see what a total wreck the man became.

The sad show would have been worth it if Ed smashed a guitar over Sam’s head.

[Terry]

To be perfectly blunt... they weren't smart enough to know what market research was or how to go about doing it. They were kids who barely graduated high school immersed in the 70's Southern California party scene... they were lucky and talented enough musically to find a way to make enough money to fuel their alcohol and drug use, get laid and never have to work a real job in their life... the lucky part made them millionaires... not their business smarts.

"Their way"... was a short step up from being homeless street bums. Ed almost went full circle if look at him 2004-2006 for the shape and mental hole he dug himself into...

All of that feels like it has far more than a mere ring of truth about it.

[Terry]

We got to see the Side Show Bob Smoking Loon wino Ed for one simple reason. His family were so desperate to get him sober before he killed himself that they figured getting him out on a tour would force him to be responsible because Ed took his profession serious but at home he devolved into a fucked up bum. They used Wolfgang to bait Ed out on tour, luckily the kid could play and sing well enough to fill in for Mike. But it didn’t work. The public got to see what a total wreck the man became.

The sad show would have been worth it if Ed smashed a guitar over Sam’s head.

And outside of that guitar smashing incident - which was at...what, the last show of the tour if memory serves - that 2004 tour wasn't even a memorable train wreck.

You look at the US Festival, where the band got a massive amount of money to perform a single show in front of 300,000 people, showed up drunk and managed to pull the gig off anyway. Even what happened post-US Fest until Dave left in 1985. The group weren't getting along, yet they still put out one of their biggest selling albums and followed that up with a lengthy tour that sold out wherever they went.

Contrast that with 2004, where the group could barely manage to cobble together a few mediocre tracks for a greatest hits album and a tour that played to audiences which were half-full once the word of mouth got out how the band was underperforming.

At least Roth went out of Van Halen on top, twice. Hagar went out of Van Halen the last time with a whimper.

[Nitro Express]

Yeah I was at the US Festival and due to the size of it I couldn’t see what condition the band was in but Dave was obviously pretty wasted but after a few songs he kind of sobered up and by the end part of the show he was fine. Years later I watched the video and saw what I couldn’t see being there. Ha! Ha! They did have a video screen above the stage but it was a far cry from the screens they use now.

[Terry]

Yeah I was at the US Festival and due to the size of it I couldn’t see what condition the band was in but Dave was obviously pretty wasted but after a few songs he kind of sobered up and by the end part of the show he was fine. Years later I watched the video and saw what I couldn’t see being there. Ha! Ha! They did have a video screen above the stage but it was a far cry from the screens they use now.

The band were fine at the US Festival.

A little fucked up, a few flubs here and there, but they pulled it off. They were still at an age back then when they could get a bit sloshed and still come up with the goods.

Van Halen back then...their concerts were a party for the audience, anyway. I tend to doubt anybody in the audience then cared if it was 100% note perfect. I sure as heck didn't seeing them a year later, half in the bag myself on some low-grade homegrown weed and several belts of peppermint schnapps (hey, I was 14 years old: we took what we could get)

[Seshmeister]

i haven't watched it in a long while but my memory of it is the reason they (well Dave) pulled it off did seem to be due to the ability of cocaine to sober up a drunk person quickly.

[Terry]

Doubtless some nose candy could have countered the booze.

What would have been the point of being in Van Halen in 1983 if one couldn't get a few bumps of Bolivian Marching Powder for a boost onstage?

[LightningBolt]

Seeing this article brought me back to the board to see what you all thought - I used to post here years ago under a long forgotten username (particularly around the time ADKOT came out/the subsequent tour).

I've found myself wanting to pull for WVH over the years - I never would have had the chance to see DLR front Van Halen live without his efforts and I still rock out to ADKOT all of the time. Although a true reunion would have been preferable, it seems very likely that nothing would have happened without him. I'll always salute him for that. However, the way he portrays himself on social media / in the regular media has been a huge turnoff over the years. This article is just another example of that. Trolling the fans, whining, etc... It is personally difficult to stomach and makes it very unlikely I'll consider supporting his efforts going forward. I tried with his music and just can't get into it.

On a more happy and hopeful note for the future - I've been playing Classic Van Halen for my 10-month old. She's been getting a steady diet of baby/kiddy songs from my wife/MIL . When I fired up Jump and Panama, she snapped to attention from playing with baby toys and watched the video/smiled throughout. She particularly responded to She's the Woman where she started laughing and bopping to the music. Very proud Dad moment

[LightningBolt]

Maybe I'm crazy or just too high.... but this really could have been a decent song with the proper singer.....

Your post prompted me to listen through several of these last weekend. There are a few where it makes you wonder what could have been, although, I don't really like the guitar tone for reasons I can't explain (I'm no musician - Good Enough and 5150 are examples of that). I can't stand the way the instrumentation sounds on the OU812 and F.U.C.K. songs. Wish they had saved the instrumental for Humans Being for the 1996 "reunion" or for the ADKOT era, that track rips without you know who over top of it.

Also briefly clicked through the instrumentals for Dreams, Feels So Good, and a few other keyboard songs. Man, those have not aged well and I could handle only about 30 seconds a pop. Bad even without SH's singing/lyrics. Hard to imagine they went from writing Unchained, Full Bug, and Sinner's Swing to that type of music in such a short period of time. Wish I could see the look on DLR's face when some of the more sappy tracks were presented to him in 1985.

[Terry]

I've found myself wanting to pull for WVH over the years - I never would have had the chance to see DLR front Van Halen live without his efforts and I still rock out to ADKOT all of the time. Although a true reunion would have been preferable, it seems very likely that nothing would have happened without him. I'll always salute him for that. However, the way he portrays himself on social media / in the regular media has been a huge turnoff over the years. This article is just another example of that. Trolling the fans, whining, etc... It is personally difficult to stomach and makes it very unlikely I'll consider supporting his efforts going forward. I tried with his music and just can't get into it.

Probably nothing would have happened with Dave had Ed not brought Wolfgang into the band. That had solely to do with Ed wanting to play with his son. Understandable, I suppose, and if that's what it took to get Dave back in the group as a fan one could either accept it or not. Nothing I would salute Wolfgang for - being Ed's child - in and of itself, though. Seems a bit silly to, because frankly it wasn't anything Wolfgang had a choice about. But...yeah, in the end seemingly one of the things that appeared to motivate Ed to get back with Roth, tour again, perform again and eventually get sober again was his son. Again, if that's one of the things it took to get Ed out of his tailspin, I can't consider it anything other than a net positive.

Wolfgang comes off like he has (also understandable, I suppose) an entitled attitude. I suppose given who his father was he literally does re: whatever degree of control he now has over his father's estate. Wolfgang would also be far from the first celebrity persona who makes unappealing comments on social media (plenty of non-famous people do the same). All of that is secondary to the music. I mean, nothing Wolfgang has done publicly has come even close to making me feel by default unaccepting of any of his professional output. He didn't molest underage children, for example. Thus, I gave the Mammoth tunes a fair shake. Couldn't get into them, either. Maybe Wolfgang will come up with something musically down the line I will enjoy. I wouldn't say it was impossible. As a Van Halen fan, I'd just as soon Wolfgang keep whatever feelings he has about Roth to himself. Roth earned his place in Van Halen. So did Eddie. Thus, when Ed and Dave went at each other in the press, they both had earned the right to do it. Wolfgang was born on third base and waved into home plate on a technicality: Wolfgang never earned his place in that band. His father gave it to him. There is a difference.

[Vinnie Velvet]

Your post prompted me to listen through several of these last weekend. There are a few where it makes you wonder what could have been, although, I don't really like the guitar tone for reasons I can't explain (I'm no musician - Good Enough and 5150 are examples of that). I can't stand the way the instrumentation sounds on the OU812 and F.U.C.K. songs. Wish they had saved the instrumental for Humans Being for the 1996 "reunion" or for the ADKOT era, that track rips without you know who over top of it.

Also briefly clicked through the instrumentals for Dreams, Feels So Good, and a few other keyboard songs. Man, those have not aged well and I could handle only about 30 seconds a pop. Bad even without SH's singing/lyrics. Hard to imagine they went from writing Unchained, Full Bug, and Sinner's Swing to that type of music in such a short period of time. Wish I could see the look on DLR's face when some of the more sappy tracks were presented to him in 1985.

I believe one of those sappy tracks presented to Dave in '85 was Dreams.

Yeah I would've said wtf to that as well.

[Terry]

Think the only 5150 album tunes I might have even wanted Dave to take a stab at were maybe Good Enough, Get Up, Summer Nights and the title track. And even some of those were kinda pedestrian just guitar-wise in comparison to the CVH stuff.

[Vinnie Velvet]

Think the only 5150 album tunes I might have even wanted Dave to take a stab at were maybe Good Enough, Get Up, Summer Nights and the title track. And even some of those were kinda pedestrian just guitar-wise in comparison to the CVH stuff.

I believe Dave did work on Summer Nights or whatever they were calling it before it became that. And maybe Good Enough as Ed had the general riff from one of the tracks he did for the Wild Life.