another take on Ed's playing and attitude.

[MUSICMANN]

Alright guys, please don't kill me on this one, just read and think about this for a minute. I really don't think Ed's playing as of late has anything to do with him being drunk or whatever. i was thinking about this and instead of looking at his playing from a fan standpoint, i thought about it from a musician's way of thinking. let me explain, here's a guy who from day 1 was taught to be perfect, not ever to make a mistake. When your young and going through the yrs. getting better and better, in Ed's case, he got great very quickly, kind of putting yourself in a box, playing what you know the best, the most. Then in Ed's case getting the band togeither and playing live, still with a must play very accurate attitude. Ed even stated that at a very young age he was taught to be very disciplined on whatever instrument he was playing . Now let's get to the point where he is a 17 or 18 yr. old guy, a guitar wizard, as he was. Vh has now become a big thing in southern Cal, Here's a guy who plays better than anyone out there, get's on stage and is just perfect. Ed is just one of those rare players that never fucks up live, that's just the facts. But Ed does fuck up, it's just that he does it out of the publics eye. All those great songs on the six pack albums put togeither with alot of fucked up night and days of playing. When it was all said and done and they were on tour supporting the album, he had already created a box around those songs and when playing live, he didn't dare to stray to far away in his playing. So with every new album there was a box that was put up around those songs he played live, from the first album to the last one. Even through the Spammy yrs. it didn't change. So you have Ed creating all this great guitar work, in the studio fucking up all over and just experamenting like crazy. If you think that those tunes are created on first thought and are perfect from the first strum of the pick, your wrong. Now lets get to his playing on this tour. Now i'm not going into the whole Sammy sucks thing and it should of been Dave stuff, i'm talking only about ED. first, your playing does not get worse as you get older it get's better, unless you get three fingers cut off or have a stroke or something, so let's throw that theory out the window. sunday night those guys were in Biloxi, well i'm from BR. and i was listening to the local rock radio, and they were taking calls about the show. Some said it was good , and some said it was alright, but were classic VH fans. But they all were talking about Ed's playing. They never said it was bad just that he missed a few notes and in his solo, he played all this off the wall stuff. One guy said that before he started his solo, Ed came to the microphone and said, he didn't know what he was going to play next, he is just having a ball and playing whatever comes to mind. He said that sometime's it comes out great and if it doesn't tonight, just laugh with me about it, then he went off on some blues stuff. the point i'm trying to make is, I don't believe it's a drunk thing or a can't play no more thing, it's Ed playing live out of the box he has been in since he first started playing. Going at it from a, i 'm going to play free and uninhibated live. Does everyone know how much balls it takes to do that, get up on stage and just play and create new runs and riffs on the run. Now i'm just talking to the dudes here on this site who plays, not just guitar, any instrument. Everyone here that reads what i'm am saying is going to have their opinion on this, thats fine, but everyone here does not play music, and that's where i'm coming from on this. To play free and out of the box like Ed is doing, with his stature and just who he is, takes incredable courage and a sense of knowing who you are. For yrs. he has been doing what everyone else does, play and create in the studio, work out all of the mistakes and try to play perfect. But on this tour, he opened himself up, to try and play new things in old songs and not play inside that box. It sucks if you went and payed $200.00 for the show and you get a guy who probably made you pick up a guitar and start playing, do the exact opposite of what you where accustomed to for all these yrs. As a guitar player myself, i know that if i stay in my box and play nothing but what i'm comfortable playing, i will never grow as a musician, and that goes for Ed himself. People who are going to this tour is just seeing this first hand from Ed. You can say what you will about his his playing, i think the dude is just be a creative musician, and not being afraid to show people that he is just human and even the best of the best can and do make mistakes. thats how we all grow. Now since i know my brothern here, let the flames fly baby.

[MUSICMANN]

Sorry dudes for not paragraphing.

[Matt White]

Re: another take on Ed's playing and attitude.

Originally posted by MUSICMANN
Alright guys, please don't kill me on this one, just read and think about this for a minute.

OKAY.....1 minute.....
A totaly absurd explanation for EVH's sub-standard playing on this tour. If that is what you want to tell yourself, feel free. Now, I am going to disregard any further attempts by you to rationalize this travesty.


FUCK YOU Van Hagar!!!:fucku2: :fucku2: :fucku2:

[lms2]

I have expressed ideas along this line before, but on this site they fall on deaf ears. Another idea that I have expressed on here is that Ed goes overboard on the "i'm only human" bit. He is/was whatever, a rock icon for crimineys sake.

True that he is not stuck in the "box" that you speak of. I am one of the fans that enjoyed just seeing him play-what and how he wanted to play. Truth of the matter though is that Eddie laying on stage playing in front of 6,000 or so people was not "comfortable and natural". It was sick and disgusting.

They are in need of ideas...and Spam is not the one to be getting them from.

[sambo]

If Dave could be convinced that a proper VH reunion was a good idea, he would have:

1. Locked the sisters in the studio until they were fit to play, even if it meant 6 months;
2. Told Mikey to "never play that lame fckn bass solo as long as I am on stage"
3. Scoffed at the publicity machines push to absolutley fck up 3 new songs with crap lyrics and do a reunion tour. Wait til you fckn get it right and do a whole new album.

Ed's playing comes down to alcohol and laziness, but that is just my opinion. And also lack of practice... he was quoted in a guitar mag he has been playing the oboe and other shit... well now it's clear... it's been at the expense of his guitar playing..

It's simple... Dave would not have tolerated this substandard shit...

[badhorsie]

I've never thought of Eddie as a "Studied" or a "trained" player. He is a very loose and very "Live" type of musician. He needs ALOT and i mean ALOT of live shows under his belt to get back what he's lost sitting around for years.

[lms2]

What he needs is motivation to want to be that good again.

Its easy when you are young and want to make a name for yourself; or when you have an inner need to prove yourself. Now, it really wouldn't surprise me to see him play "tuba". At least that is something he hasn't done live yet.

[sambo]

Originally posted by lms2
What he needs is motivation to want to be that good again.

Agreed.. good call.

I believe Dave could provide that motivation or at least have enough motivation that it becomes infectious on the rest of the band.

It just appears, with Spam, they are going through the motions.

[lms2]

Like looking for love in all the wrong places?

[MUSICMANN]

If it was the booze, then how was he able to play wtih that much perfection all those yrs. And yes Ed was a classical trained pianist very eary. He even said his teacher would scold him if he missed a note. Now getting out there and laying on stage is another thing. And yes i do also call this tour a travesty, but i'm not talking about anyone else but Ed. I'm not saying that i prefer him, to me opening up and just playing what comes to mind, in the middle of a song. I want to see the production and the mastery of his playing note for note. But after the horrible response VHIII got, i think that he just said fuck it, and decided instead of exploring new sounds and playing on a new album, he's doing it live. I just can't see him losing any skills from not playing live for 5 yrs. He still was playing in the studio and for a guy that is a pro like Ed is, you never lose your ability to play.

[lms2]

Like riding a bicycle...

[lms2]

except that some people set themselves up to fail. Is Ed so insecure that he is afraid to really pour his sole into creating kick ass. I mean, gosh, the guy paved the way and wrote the rules for so long... but there is always some young hot shot out there to take what you did, and make it better.

Like the guy who says "I am number 2, I don't try at all." Cheap chicken shit... All he is saying is that I am afraid to give it all I got, cuz it just might not be good enough.

[sambo]

Originally posted by MUSICMANN
If it was the booze, then how was he able to play wtih that much perfection all those yrs. And yes Ed was a classical trained pianist very eary. He even said his teacher would scold him if he missed a note. Now getting out there and laying on stage is another thing. And yes i do also call this tour a travesty, but i'm not talking about anyone else but Ed. I'm not saying that i prefer him, to me opening up and just playing what comes to mind, in the middle of a song. I want to see the production and the mastery of his playing note for note. But after the horrible response VHIII got, i think that he just said fuck it, and decided instead of exploring new sounds and playing on a new album, he's doing it live. I just can't see him losing any skills from not playing live for 5 yrs. He still was playing in the studio and for a guy that is a pro like Ed is, you never lose your ability to play.

I agree it should be like riding a bicycle, but after 5 years of little riding, you are not going to be able to jump that house you once did, it will take time. No doubting he has the chops, it is EVH, but anyone that does not play (especially live) for an extended period of time and then goes back out on stage is bound to suffer.

maybe, as badhorsie said, he just needs a shitload of live gigs to get it completely back under his fingers. That's all they used to do for years and years on end play show after show and it all falls into place.

I wish Ed no harm, just don't want to see him disappoint his fans, and that's all I seem to be hearing.

[MUSICMANN]

question to Matt White, Do you play and what instrument. Cause if you do than you would understand what i was talking about, Playing songs that you have mastered and not opening up and giving yourself a challenge, is not growth as a musician. You don't have to be famous and play in front of a million people to be a musician and want to become a better player, but you do need to want to take risks when your playing, and that risk sometimes causes you to fall flat on your face. It's what you do to learn from that mistake that makes you a better player. that's how i see Ed playing right now.

[MUSICMANN]

I can understand some of not playing live thing, but remember, we are not talking about your average Joe guitar player, we are talking about a true natural player, not even just a natural player, but one out of 2 or 3 guys ever to pick up the guitar. Shit even in the mid 80's and early 90's they went for 3 yrs. between albums and live gigs.