DaveIsKing WAS WRONG!!! Bush Sucks!

[DaveIsKing]

I voted for him. And he pulls this fucking shit AGAIN...why didn't he do it BEFORE the election???

Because he knew the majority of Americans and LEGAL immigrants oppose it.

http://www.washtimes.com/national/20041110-123424-5467r.htm

Fuck you, you goddamn asshole. I can only hope he angers the Republicans enought to shove this bullshit back down his throat.

[Dr. Love]

That will cost him a lot of 'political capital' that I'd rather see spent on Tax Reform and Social Security Reform.

[FORD]

Pretty goddamn pathetic when it's harder for an American to get into Canada for a week than it is for a Mexican to get into America permanently.

Another stellar example of BCE "leadership"

[aesop]

I agree I'm not really happy with this. I think he's taking 'Compassionate Conservative' too far. There are already rumblings in the House and Senate. I hope this is a one-shot deal.

The only thing that would be realy funny is if all of the Mexicans moved to California and voted Republican.

[FORD]

Originally posted by aesop
I agree I'm not really happy with this. I think he's taking 'Compassionate Conservative' too far. There are already rumblings in the House and Senate. I hope this is a one-shot deal.

The only thing that would be realy funny is if all of the Mexicans moved to California and voted Republican.

I'm sure that's the entire plan. And if a few "terra-ists" walk across the border with them, hey...even more "political capital" for pResident Diebold.

[Denny]

Originally posted by FORD
I'm sure that's the entire plan. And if a few "terra-ists" walk across the border with them, hey...even more "political capital" for pResident Diebold.

Could you run the Country any better, Fuck tard????

[aesop]

Yea, the border's a problem. But at least us conservatives on this board can admit when we don't like our own partie's policies. I've yet to see that from the left.

[Cathedral]

Not like the brazen giant of Greek fame,
With conquering limbs astride from land to land;
Here at our sea-washed, sunset gates shall stand
A mighty woman with a torch whose flame
Is imprisoned lightning, and her name
Mother of Exiles. From her beacon-hand
Glows world-wide welcome; her mild eyes command
The air-bridged harbor that twin cities frame.
"Keep ancient lands your storied pomp!" cries she with silent lips.

"Give me your tired your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Emma Lazarus (1849-1887)



I am against closing off the borders, and i personally think it is a good thing to give illegals a way in which they can provide for their families a better income than they can have in Mexico.
It is a step in the right direction if we can document all who enter this country from foreign lands.
Family Values do not stop at our border, and they are eager to work those jobs which most Americans refuse to work.

If you really think about it, this does go a long way in securing our borders from those who cross it. If they want a job, then they must register in the work force program, and if it works they way i assume it will, it will be a crime for an employer to employ an alien without the proper documents to prove they are in fact eligible to work in the United States.

Bush did interviews during the campaign on this subject, so i don't see where he "downplayed it"...This comes as no surprise to me, and i see it as a step in the right direction.

You cannot fault anyone for seeking a better quality of life.
This would be a huge leap in decreasing the number of illegals crossing the border who we would otherwise not know are here.

Think about it, If so many people are here illegally, don't you think that if they had a way to be tracked it would also help by decreasing the number of questionable people roaming our cities?

I think it would make it easier to spot those who try to fly into our country under the radar, with intent to attack us.

It wouldn't solve the whole problem of course, but it does fall in line of what this country has stood for for over 200 years.
And knowing who is here from other lands is much better than not knowing.
Coming to America should not be a crime, and for those who wish to remain Mexican citizens, they should have a way to come and go without being deamed a criminal.

The Statue of Liberty has been a long standing invitation to immigrants to seek a better life, and you can't invite people to your home for dinner and then make them eat outside while you sit at the dining room table.

Look, working with those who seek to work here is far better than placing soldiers on the borders that will surely lead to people getting killed when their only desire is a better life for their families and themselves.

[DaveIsKing]

Sure, let's reward illegal behavior and kill the "sanctity of citizenship". Isn't a priviledge to be an American anymore? Natural-born or Naturalized?

What the hell is the benefit when illegals can come in and get all the benefits without paying their "dues"? Fuck'em!

That's why people hate illegals. It isn't because they are from Mexico or Cuba. It is because the government REWARDS them for BREAKING THE LAW while CITIZENS and LEGAL IMMIGRANTS suffer the consequences.

Sorry, Catheral. This is the real world, not utopia.

[Cathedral]

No, this is America, Land of the Free and Home of The Brave.

Don't insult me by telling me i'm not living in the real world. I am one of the few people i know that hasn't changed my view of what America stands for because of 9-11.

You want to have a knee-jerk reaction to it and close off the borders, sytematically flipping off the world...I don't agree with that message, and that is my point.

They pay taxes on their incomes here, so what dues exactly are you referring to?
I guess if you live in say, Ohio...You can't work in Kentucky?

I don't understand this "Slam the door" mentallity, unless it is based on fear.
I have no fear of anything on this earth. If i am killed then it is what it is, and it will be God's will.

Yeah, I live in Utopia? Give me a break, YOU live in fear and would like to change the goal of America by shutting down the borders...sorry, but you just said to the terrorists that they win.

[DaveIsKing]

Ok, Let us just begin to legalize illegal behavior across the board. Fuck citizenship!!



DUES?? TAXES???

Most illegal aliens do not receive a typical paycheck with tax deductions -- they are paid in cash and do not pay taxes. Even when they do pay taxes (only possible if they use fraudulent social security numbers or government assigned ID tax numbers), their meager income is not enough to pay for medical expenses and all the expenses for all the children they give birth to. You don't have to look at statistics -- just visit the maternal ward at the L.A. county hospital. There, illegal immigrant women are having thousands of children per year free of charge and can't afford them once they give birth, and that doesn't stop them from having even more children -- most learn how to work the system so that they receive cash assistance and food stamps.

A basic principle in economics is this: The more people that assimilate into the system the better -- if it creates a larger tax base. But it hasn't. For example, the feds had to bail out the L.A. County hospital system several years ago and the county hospitals are now again headed for another crisis. The evidence shows that the net results are that illegal immigrants cost the taxpayer significantly more than they pay in taxes.

[Cathedral]

I can't and won't argue that point, for it is a valid one.

Look man, I'm not saying that the system doesn't need an overhaul. All i am saying is that Bush has a plan to eliminate a large number of illegals that don't want to become citizens of the U.S.

Times have surely changed though, that is a fact, so we must adapt to keep our country secure.
The problem though isn't with those crossing the borders to find better paying jobs. The problem is as you pointed out, Employers bucking the system by hiring illegals who are paid under the table.

Let's put the blame where it belongs, and if they couldn't find those "under the table" jobs in the first place, it wouldn't be an issue.

I worked for a company that employed Mexicans that had no green cards or S.S. numbers, but they still paid the same tax i did by having a work ID#.

These are the people i believe Bush is trying to help by giving them an incentive to follow the laws of immigration.

I see your point, but i think your conclusion is pre-mature, that's all.

[DaveIsKing]

"The problem is as you pointed out, Employers bucking the system by hiring illegals who are paid under the table."

This is true.

But, Bush is trying to be another Woodrow Wilson-- Saviour of the World. It didn't work then and it won't work now.

I am sick of international presidents, how about another American president. I hate to say it, but at least Bill "Playboy" Clinton concentrated on AMERICA instead of everywhere else all the damn time. And he knew to send that boy back to Cuba where his Daddy was.

[DaveIsKing]

Originally posted by Cathedral
I can't and won't argue that point, for it is a valid one.

Look man, I'm not saying that the system doesn't need an overhaul. All i am saying is that Bush has a plan to eliminate a large number of illegals that don't want to become citizens of the U.S.

Times have surely changed though, that is a fact, so we must adapt to keep our country secure.
The problem though isn't with those crossing the borders to find better paying jobs. The problem is as you pointed out, Employers bucking the system by hiring illegals who are paid under the table.

Let's put the blame where it belongs, and if they couldn't find those "under the table" jobs in the first place, it wouldn't be an issue.

I worked for a company that employed Mexicans that had no green cards or S.S. numbers, but they still paid the same tax i did by having a work ID#.

These are the people i believe Bush is trying to help by giving them an incentive to follow the laws of immigration.

I see your point, but i think your conclusion is pre-mature, that's all.

WHAT ABOUT "ANCHOR BABIES"?

[FORD]

Originally posted by Denny
Could you run the Country any better, Fuck tard????

Hell yes I could.