Gitmo: A National Disgrace

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  • Hyman Roth
    Veteran
    • Nov 2006
    • 1817

    Gitmo: A National Disgrace

    Editorial
    Gitmo: A National Disgrace
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    Published: June 6, 2007
    Ever since President Bush rammed the Military Commissions Act of 2006 through Congress to lend a pretense of legality to his detention camp at Guantánamo Bay, Cuba, we have urged Congress to amend the law to restore basic human rights and judicial process. Rulings by military judges this week suggest that the special detention system is so fundamentally corrupt that the only solution is to tear it down and start again.

    The target of the judges’ rulings were Combatant Status Review Tribunals, panels that determine whether a prisoner is an “unlawful enemy combatant” who can be tried by one of the commissions created by the 2006 law. The tribunals are, in fact, kangaroo courts that give the inmates no chance to defend themselves, allow evidence that was obtained through torture and can be repeated until one produces the answer the Pentagon wants.

    On Monday, two military judges dismissed separate war crimes charges against two Guantánamo inmates because of the status review system. They said the Pentagon managed to get them declared “enemy combatants,” but not “unlawful enemy combatants,” and moved to try them anyway under the 2006 law. That law says only unlawful combatants may be tried by military commissions. Lawful combatants (those who wear uniforms and carry weapons openly) fall under the Geneva Conventions.

    If the administration loses an appeal, which it certainly should, it will no doubt try to tinker with the review tribunals so they produce the desired verdict. Congress cannot allow that. When you can’t win a bet with loaded dice, something is wrong with the game.

    There is only one path likely to lead to a result that would allow Americans to once again hold their heads high when it comes to justice and human rights. First, Congress needs to restore the right of the inmates of Guantánamo Bay to challenge their detentions. By the administration’s own count, only a small minority of the inmates actually deserve a trial. The rest should be sent home or set free.

    Second, Congress should repeal the Military Commissions Act and start anew on a just system for determining whether prisoners are unlawful combatants. Among other things, evidence obtained through coercion and torture should be banned.

    And Congress should shut down Guantánamo Bay, as called for in bills sponsored by two California Democrats, Representative Jane Harman in the House and Senator Dianne Feinstein in the Senate. Both lawmakers are intimately familiar with the camp and have concluded it is beyond salvaging.

    Their bill would close Gitmo in a year and the detainees would be screened by real courts. Those who are truly illegal combatants would be sent to military or civilian jails in the United States, to be tried under time-tested American rules of justice, or sent to an international tribunal. Some would be returned to their native lands for trial, if warranted. The rest would be set free, as they should have been long ago.

    The Guantánamo camp was created on a myth — that the American judicial system could not handle prisoners of “the war against terror.” It was built on a lie — that the hundreds of detainees at Gitmo are all dangerous terrorists. And it was organized around a fiction — that Mr. Bush had the power to create this rogue system in the first place.

    It is time to get rid of it.

    Trollidillo-T
  • Hyman Roth
    Veteran
    • Nov 2006
    • 1817

    #2
    I haven't read the Military Commissions Act of 2006, and I am struggling to understand all the issues involved, but it seems to me a basic matter of human rights that these people should have the right to challenge their detainment instead of being held indefinately without a trial on the merits of their cases.

    If anyone being detained committed acts of terrorism against the United States, then have a trial, prove it, and punish the guilty accordingly. If not - let them go.

    Its a basic virtue in America that the accused should have a right to a speedy trial and the opportunity to face their accusers in a court of law. I shudder to think how many innocent people are being kept from their families and lives while they rot away and are possibly being tortured in Bush's persecution camp. If it is only one person, then that is one too many.
    Last edited by Hyman Roth; 06-07-2007, 01:24 PM.
    Trollidillo-T

    Comment

    • Wallyg
      Groupie
      • Aug 2005
      • 69

      #3
      Here's how we used to handle "terrorists."

      FBI History
      Famous Cases

      George John Dasch and the Nazi Saboteurs

      Shortly after midnight on the morning of June 13, 1942, four men landed on a beach near Amagansett, Long Island, New York, from a German submarine, clad in German uniforms and bringing ashore enough explosives, primers, and incendiaries to support an expected two-year career in the sabotage of American defense-related production. On June 17, 1942, a similar group landed on Ponte Vedra Beach, near Jacksonville, Florida, equipped for a similar career in industrial disruption.

      The purpose of the invasions was to strike a major blow for Germany by bringing the violence of war to our home ground through destruction of America's ability to manufacture vital equipment and supplies and transport them to the battlegrounds of Europe; to strike fear into the American civilian population, and diminish the resolve of the United States to overcome our enemies.

      By June 27, 1942, all eight saboteurs had been arrested without having accomplished one act of destruction. Tried before a Military Commission, they were found guilty. One was sentenced to life imprisonment, another to thirty years, and six received the death penalty, which was carried out within a few days.

      The eight were tried before a Military Commission, comprised of seven U.S. Army officers appointed by President Roosevelt, from July 8, to August 4, 1942. The trial was held in the Department of Justice Building, Washington, D.C. The prosecution was headed by Attorney General Frances Biddle and the Army Judge Advocate General, Major General Myron C. Cramer. Defense counsel included Colonel Kenneth C. Royall (later Secretary of War under President Truman) and Major Lausen H. Stone (son of Harlan Fiske Stone, the Chief Justice of the U.S. Supreme Court).

      All eight were found guilty and sentenced to death. Attorney General Biddle and J. Edgar Hoover appealed to President Roosevelt to commute the sentences of Dasch and Burger. Dasch then received a 30-year sentence, and Burger received a life sentence, both to be served in a federal penitentiary. The remaining six were executed at the District of Columbia Jail on August 8, 1942.
      "Do your damnedest in an ostentatious manner all the time. "
      George S. Patton
      "Anyone who says he can see through women is missing a lot."
      Groucho Marx (1890 - 1977)

      Comment

      • hideyoursheep
        ROTH ARMY ELITE
        • Jan 2007
        • 6351

        #4
        Originally posted by Wallyg
        Here's how we used to handle "terrorists."



        The eight were tried before a Military Commission, comprised of seven U.S. Army officers appointed by President Roosevelt, from July 8, to August 4, 1942. The trial was held in the Department of Justice Building, Washington, D.C. The prosecution was headed by Attorney General Frances Biddle and the Army Judge Advocate General, Major General Myron C. Cramer. Defense counsel included Colonel Kenneth C. Royall (later Secretary of War under President Truman) and Major Lausen H. Stone (son of Harlan Fiske Stone, the Chief Justice of the U.S. Supreme Court).
        When do the trials begin for thr Gitmo suspects?

        Comment

        • Angel
          ROTH ARMY SUPREME
          • Jan 2004
          • 7481

          #5
          Originally posted by hideyoursheep
          When do the trials begin for thr Gitmo suspects?
          Some have started already. In fact, charges were just dismissed against Canadian Omar Khadr, unfortunately. The little bastard comes from a family of Al-Qaeda connected terrorists, but the US fucked up on this one. (Just as we fucked up when we rescued his Dad years ago).

          Still no word on when he'll actually gets released.

          "Ya know what they say about angels... An angel is a supernatural being or spirit, usually humanoid in form, found in various religions and mythologies. Plus Roth fan boards..."- ZahZoo April 2013

          Comment

          • hideyoursheep
            ROTH ARMY ELITE
            • Jan 2007
            • 6351

            #6
            Charges were dropped and you're calling him a little bastard?

            I don't get it.

            So, he's guilty anyway?

            Comment

            • WACF
              Crazy Ass Mofo
              • Jan 2004
              • 2920

              #7
              Yes...he is guilty.


              ....Judge Army Col Peter Brownback ruled that the military commissions did not have the jurisdiction to hear Khadr’s case following a brief hearing today.

              He got off on a technicality.

              Comment

              • Hyman Roth
                Veteran
                • Nov 2006
                • 1817

                #8
                The charges were dismissed "without prejudice"...which means he can be charged again.
                Trollidillo-T

                Comment

                • Angel
                  ROTH ARMY SUPREME
                  • Jan 2004
                  • 7481

                  #9
                  Originally posted by hideyoursheep
                  Charges were dropped and you're calling him a little bastard?

                  I don't get it.

                  So, he's guilty anyway?
                  His entire family is a national disgrace to Canada.
                  "Ya know what they say about angels... An angel is a supernatural being or spirit, usually humanoid in form, found in various religions and mythologies. Plus Roth fan boards..."- ZahZoo April 2013

                  Comment

                  • hideyoursheep
                    ROTH ARMY ELITE
                    • Jan 2007
                    • 6351

                    #10
                    Originally posted by Angel
                    His entire family is a national disgrace to Canada.
                    Get rid of them if they're guilty of terrorist activity. How hard could it be to enforce?

                    Comment

                    • Angel
                      ROTH ARMY SUPREME
                      • Jan 2004
                      • 7481

                      #11
                      Originally posted by hideyoursheep
                      Get rid of them if they're guilty of terrorist activity. How hard could it be to enforce?
                      There's so much bs behind this family and their stories it's unbelievable. Supposedly, one of the sons has now renounced Al-Qaeda and is a CIA informant...

                      "Ya know what they say about angels... An angel is a supernatural being or spirit, usually humanoid in form, found in various religions and mythologies. Plus Roth fan boards..."- ZahZoo April 2013

                      Comment

                      • hideyoursheep
                        ROTH ARMY ELITE
                        • Jan 2007
                        • 6351

                        #12
                        Yes, I've seen the PBS doc on that kid. His father was killed right?

                        Yet his family still believes in the cause?

                        I believe the kid.

                        Comment

                        • Angel
                          ROTH ARMY SUPREME
                          • Jan 2004
                          • 7481

                          #13
                          Originally posted by hideyoursheep
                          Yes, I've seen the PBS doc on that kid. His father was killed right?

                          Yet his family still believes in the cause?

                          I believe the kid.
                          Yeah, father was killed and younger brother was injured. The family brought him back to Canada to take advantage of our medical. The country received a threat from Al-Qaeda that we would be attacked if we didn't provide medical attention.

                          The mother is fucking unbelievable! She's PROUD of the fact that her husband died a "martyr" and that her children have been injured pursuing the cause.

                          States they're not Al-Qaeda but sympathetic to the cause. Yet Osama was at their daughters wedding, and their is footage of them in Al-Qaeda training camps. Total Bullshit!!!!
                          "Ya know what they say about angels... An angel is a supernatural being or spirit, usually humanoid in form, found in various religions and mythologies. Plus Roth fan boards..."- ZahZoo April 2013

                          Comment

                          • Nickdfresh
                            SUPER MODERATOR

                            • Oct 2004
                            • 49567

                            #14
                            GITMO IS a motherfucking national disgrace...

                            Most of the "terrorists" there were rounded up by Northern Alliance forces and simply handed over without the slightest shred of evidence as too their guilt. And even if they weren't, I don't believe fighting in a legitimate military formation constitutes being labeled a "terrorist," because otherwise, US troops could be "terrorists" in someone else's court. Couldn't they?

                            In fact, many GITMO inmates are probably guilty of only owing money, or sleeping with the daughter, of some tribal chieftain...

                            If someone is a terrorist baby-killer, make no mistake, I think they should be killed, or serve life without parole so they can have their assholes raped daily...

                            But everyone deserves a fair trial, man. They deserve the right to face their accuser...

                            And apparently, in many cases, their accuser is as bad or worse --morally speaking...

                            Comment

                            • Hyman Roth
                              Veteran
                              • Nov 2006
                              • 1817

                              #15
                              Originally posted by Nickdfresh
                              GITMO IS a motherfucking national disgrace...


                              Exactamundo and well said, as usual, Nick.
                              Trollidillo-T

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