Obama has so far...

[LoungeMachine]

No, man. The point is, they have a better chance of surviving if we catch them first.

Quick, get in the van, we'll take you to Gitmo before they catch you......

phew, that was close.



Sorry, not following the logic.

[LoungeMachine]

Habeus Corpus has been the basic human rule of law for 700 years.......

WTF we decided unilaterally to ignore it NOW, is beyond me.

[hideyoursheep]

Habeus Corpus has been the basic human rule of law for 700 years........

Now if the Iraqis can just learn to spell it..



I don't offer up any excuses for Gitmo, I'm only laying out to you the 'alternative' for the captured.

[LoungeMachine]

The problem lies in the fact many of the Gitmo "lucky ones" were turned over for their BOUNTY, and have no real evidence against them they're "terrorists"

If we can't try them, why do we continue to hold them?

[hideyoursheep]

The problem lies in the fact many of the Gitmo "lucky ones" were turned over for their BOUNTY, and have no real evidence against them they're "terrorists"

If we can't try them, why do we continue to hold them?

Anyone who is a citizen should be given due process, absolutely.

Anyone who isn't should be deported back to where they were.

[hideyoursheep]

....Well....at least keep it open for the BCE board of directors meeting!



If only......if only there were enough spine to investigate...

[LoungeMachine]

I know YOU get it...

The question was more rhetorical in nature.....




I'm just amazed that the TNG's of the world out there, who wave the flag the loudest, and spout off about "terrorists" and "enemies" are always the ones who seem to want to EMULATE the tactics of the dictators they supposed abhor.

ya know?

[GAR]

It's the Bizzaro President! Up is down..

[hideyoursheep]

...until they have a cell right next to Tommy Chong at Gitmo.

Yeah, I get it...

[knuckleboner]

Yeah, I can't say I agree with these moves. I'm fine with closing gitmo, but bringing a bunch of terrorists into the states? What the fuck is that idea about?
Best case scenario they get killed in prison, if not they could just spread their bullshit ideals to Americans who are in prison.

the people currently held in guantanemo have been held, indefinitely, as enemy combatants.

if they are terrorists, great. if they're not, then what? are we assuming that the military hasn't made one mistake? that every single person picked up is without question a terrorist? well, if that's the case, then why not try them in a court of law? obviously we're rock solid at always getting the terrorist.

[Nickdfresh]

Define "rights". Last I heard these terrorists are not American citizens and are therefore not afforded rights held under the American Constitution.

Neither were Germans captured and held as POWs during WWII. They were still afforded the basic protections as prisoners of War under the Geneva Conventions....

These are not, common thief’s, these are killers or people conspiring to kill Americans at all costs, even if it means their own lives.

They also haven't convicted of anything. And many of them were either guys who tried to kill US troops in Afghanistan - which in itself is not an act of terror or you are calling US servicemen 'terrorists' because we did the same thing...

Or they were people on the wrong side of a dispute with a Northern Alliance (now Afghan gov't official) and probably owed the wrong guy money or insulted his family in some way...

Or they are hardened terrorists that should be tried and imprisoned or executed...

Now, last I heard there were something like 26 trials scheduled in the next 3 months that are now on hold. So obviously these people are not just sitting there rotting forever with no trial in sight. Can they set bail like in the U.S. and go free until their court date NO. WHY? Because they would never show up!

That does not mean we are out rounding up every innocent Muslim, like Hitler with the Jews, and condemning them to death.

These people were caught either in the act of terrorism, or conspiring to commit terrorism, or found with some sort of paraphernalia that incriminated them.

Do I feel sorry for them? Hell no! I feel sorry for the families of the 3000+ soldiers and 3000+ 911 victims that died because of these crazy sum bitches.

Their trials were little more than military kangaroo courts with little legal precedent or even legitimacy and staged by the previous admin showing little respect for the rule of law. An Admin that even tried to label US citizens as alleged "terrorists," and tried to deny them their constitutional rights by just legally making it up as they went...

And probably 98% of the people at GITMO had nothing to do with 9/11. That was a very few members of whatever constituted "al Qaida," which is in itself an exaggeration...

So do us all a favor and take your pity for the enemy and shove it up

Wow, strong statement from a chickenhawk. If you're such a badass and it is all so simple, than go become a Navy SEAL yo and kill all teh terra-ists, pussybitch.

[TongueNGroove]

You guys do realise that there are people in America who sit in jail for years waiting to be tried right? Our court systems are so bogged down that there is no telling how long these Gitmo guys would be sitting in jail before they got a trial even if they are moved to America. How would it be any different?


The only difference would be that if you put them in general population they would all most likely be killed by other inmates unless we build them their own prison system (i.e. another Gitmo based here in the States).

Neither were Germans captured and held as POWs during WWII. They were still afforded the basic protections as prisoners of War under the Geneva Conventions....



They also haven't convicted of anything. And many of them were either guys who tried to kill US troops in Afghanistan - which in itself is not an act of terror or you are calling US servicemen 'terrorists' because we did the same thing...

Or they were people on the wrong side of a dispute with a Northern Alliance (now Afghan gov't official) and probably owed the wrong guy money or insulted his family in some way...

Or they are hardened terrorists that should be tried and imprisoned or executed....

Are you even familiar with the Geneva Conventions? If not, do a little reading about them http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geneva_Conventions . In particular read the Third Geneva convention.

In order for an enemy to be afforded the rights held under the Third Geneva Convention (Which covers POW's) they have to follow certain rules.

Article 4 defines prisoners of war to include:
4.1.1 Members of the armed forces of a Party to the conflict and members of militias of such armed forces
4.1.2 Members of other militias and members of other volunteer corps, including those of organized resistance movements, provided that they fulfill all of the following conditions:

• that of being commanded by a person responsible for his subordinates;
• that of having a fixed distinctive sign recognizable at a distance (there are limited exceptions to this among countries who observe the 1977 Protocol I);
• that of carrying arms openly;
• that of conducting their operations in accordance with the laws and customs of war.

Last I checked, these guys are not following ANY of these rules. They are not sponsored by any country.


Also, we supply medical aid to all wounded enemies. Yah it sucks to have a guy try to blow your head off and then you have to turn around and try to save his life, but we do it.


These guys are not covered under the Geneva conventions.

[LoungeMachine]

You guys do realise that there are people in America who sit in jail for years waiting to be tried right? .

Years?

Name one.

[TongueNGroove]

Years was an exageration obviously, but it can take many months to even get to trial and then there is the whole trial process which can take another month or two (depending on the crime of course).

That is why we have a Bail system in place in the U.S. so people don't have to sit in jail that whole time waiting. But these guys could not be allowed to go free on bail.

[LoungeMachine]

You guys do realise that there are people in America who sit in jail for years waiting to be tried right?

Years was an exageration obviously, .

Obviously?

No.

Not in the slightest.