Obama Says He Prays 'All The Time' For Guidance

[thome]

I so CRAP MYSELF when all the "Intelectuals Enlightened Elite of the World" bitch and piss all over people who believe in -The Bible-..and wait for it...a...is a..... _ _ _ _??

By telling them to read "This" or "That"............ BOOK....to free yourself of false info and become free of the control of religion and ...

OH FUKK ME!!! AH HAH AHHAAAAaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!!!!!

The world is fukking full of the stupidest bullshit assmunch mother fikkin self righteous dumbasses in the galaxy baby ............and it's all right there in black and white!!!

Let the mother fukker pray I could care less which diety he is in touch with as long as he doesn't listen to the neighborhood stray dog and go assassinate someone asper the dogs verbal instructions. .

"THAT BOOK SUUKKSS, BUT THIS ONE"......................... fits right up your ass like it was meant to be.TRY IT!!!

[bueno bob]

All you want is to try and get everybody to believe what you believe.

It's certainly more sensible than the so-called "faith based" doctrines and ideals which incessantly argue with other faith based doctrines and ideals, and inevitably call for the destruction of all those who disagree with whichever book you're reading at the time under the guise of a "holy mandate". Education and sensibility beats blind faith and oppression of opposing viewpoints any way you slice it, wouldn't you agree?

That's just plain common sense.

And you want your belief integrated into the government.

Wrong. This is the immediate perspective of the uneducated. Hear it from the religious right all the time. What is aspired are seeing laws and mindsets enacted solely from ancient myths removed from the governmental process all together. I'm sure you'll correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that it's referred to as "separation of church and state".

Religion and government in the same handcart inevitably breed chaos. A quick overview of basic religious empire in global history should establish that for you beyond any shadow of a doubt. And you rail on about "history books"! LMAO! It's brilliantly apparent that you're not exactly familiar with them yourself based on your posts. When governments become "religious", the populace governed gets trampled under tyranny by way of "holy mandate" and it needs to STOP. Entirely.

Separation of church and state. Look it up, see what it ACTUALLY means.

How is that any different from radical religious folks? How is that any different from Iran?

Exceptionally different for the reasons I just pointed out to you. Mostly, I'd call that common sense. Any third grader should be able to ascertain the difference.

You're right...it has been tried "very recently in human history." It failed. Miserably.

Really? Funny viewpoint for you to take. I don't recall atheists taking to the street with spears and torches and pitchforks and swords in an effort to lynch anybody with a religious perspective, but I'm sure you'll correct me where I'm wrong. I certainly could list you thousands of examples where the religious populace of the world did exactly that, however. And, since the atheist population is RISING considerably year after year, it seems to be the case to those with a base ability to reason that they were the ones who inevitably failed.

People everywhere, from ALL walks of life and ALL religions, are waking up every day and realizing that ancient dogma that worked for sheep herders out in the field thousands of years ago no longer applies in this day and age. Like 8 track tapes, monogamous relationships, marriages that last and nuclear families that earn enough money to survive on, it's an outdated concept that has lived longer than it's expiration date. Sensible, rational people see that as apparent.

Opposing Views: NEWS: Survey Shows Number of U.S. Christians Falling, Atheists Rising

The State News: Rising numbers of nonbelievers increase popularity of atheism

Atheists Looking to Give and Receive Community Support - ABC News

http://www.dakotavoice.com/2009/02/humanist-group-contends-atheism-on-the-rise/

There's about a half a million more news articles from both the religious and the non religious news agencies out there, among other independent sources, but I'll leave you to your own devices regarding your enlightenment and self discovery as to the declining state of all religions in the world.

Let me clarify...get your head out of the Dawkins comic books and read a history book.

Maybe you should try one yourself? Atheists, the non religious, whatever you care to call them...people are getting educated and realizing that religion is a fool's game. There's no denying it. Except, maybe, for you and the religious. Go back to the sand, your hole's getting cold without your head in it...

Ignorant child.

Said the dimwit who his demonstrates his lack of education on the current state of the world regarding the subject? LOL

Don't worry; you pray for me, I'll think for you.

[Blackflag]

It's certainly more sensible than the so-called "faith based" doctrines...

That's your opinion. Start a website and try to get people to agree with you.

What is aspired are seeing laws. . .

Once you want laws enacted, you're using the government to convince people of your beliefs. In your first post, you said you wanted "education," presumably in the schools, to convince people of your viewpoint. And whether you're a jew, christian, or athiest, that's contrary to the first amendment and morally disgusting. That's no different than me saying I want laws and "education" that will convince people to convert to Islam. The only difference is that you think your religion is "common sense."

You're obviously very wound up about this topic, and your idea of a discussion is ranting like a child and calling me a third grader. So I'll leave the discussion with this: You're free to believe in atheism as much as you like, and raise your kids however you like. Once you start espousing government laws and education to convert others to your beliefs, you've become just another controlling fanatic that you hate so much.

If you have such a hard-on for converting people to your beliefs, start a website and go door-to-door just like all the other zealots have to. Leave the government out of it.

Really? Funny viewpoint for you to take. I don't recall atheists taking to the street with spears and torches and pitchforks and swords in an effort to lynch anybody with a religious perspective, but I'm sure you'll correct me where I'm wrong.

They didn't, they did it with the stroke of a pen, using the "laws" you're advocating. In the Soviet Union and in China. The Soviets FAILED, for a number of reasons that are too extensive to get into. China is a FAILURE in progress, and they've already started letting people practice their religions in the open again.

And your small-minded ideas: FAIL. They're just regurgitated shit from the one-sided sensationalist books you eat up.




p.s.

[bueno bob]

That's your opinion. Start a website and try to get people to agree with you.

There's half a million of them already. Based on the numbers, well, they seem to be working. More and more people are becoming sensible every day. That's not opinion; it's fact.

Once you want laws enacted, you're using the government to convince people of your beliefs.

WRONG

Again, religion belongs OUT of the law making process.

Are you having difficulty following that idea? You seem to keep defaulting to this perspective that I want "laws enacted" to keep religion out of government.

There is no need to have 'laws' against it; it just needs to be TAKEN OUT. It's not hard to figure out. I've certainly made it clear.

In your first post, you said you wanted "education," presumably in the schools, to convince people of your viewpoint.

Science isn't a "viewpoint". It's a fact, proven and established by scientific principles. Nor does it have to be done in schools alone. In fact, one could argue that I'm educating you right now. 1+1=2 because it DOES, not because, darnit all, I have faith that it does. Religion and other ideologies are opinions. People need to be educated to hard facts and informed of what's proven by science, investigation and rational evidence, not opinions or best guestimates from mystic books thousands of years old that have no verification or basis in reality outside of historical fiction (and historical fiction is a generous term, considering how many elements of religion simple science and archeology have continuously proven false and continue to do so on a daily basis).

And whether you're a jew, christian, or athiest, that's contrary to the first amendment and morally disgusting.

Whose "morals"? Yours? I think putting your hand on a bible (or any other work of historical fiction) and swearing to tell the truth while on the stand in court or be a good President or anything else is morally disgusting because it puts religion into a place of government and/or any other legal business and therefore represents an demonstration of establishment of religion in a government process. And THAT is contrary to the first amendment as well.

As far as free practice of religion? Fine. But don't congregate, don't bleed tax payers dry with tax exempt churches and don't base laws or other governmental practice around it. Go pray in a fucking closet. That's what Christ supposedly said to do anyway, right? Oh yeah: "And when you pray, you must not be like the hypocrites. For they love to stand and pray in the synagogues and at the street corners, that they may be seen by others. But when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your Father, who is unseen. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you." - Matthew 6:5-6.

What is it, amateur hour around here? I'd expect those kind of arguments out of first week born again converts. Up your game.

That's no different than me saying I want laws and "education" that will convince people to convert to Islam.

It's grossly different. Were you to take that viewpoint, than you'd want laws enacted to teach people to follow a mystic, magical, opinion-filled belief unprovable by any known scientific evidence or theory.

I espouse science. You DO know the difference between "fact" and "opinion", right?

The only difference is that you think your religion is "common sense."

Atheism isn't a religion. It's a lack of. It's also a scientific perspective based on factual evidence and historical backing with a groundwork in mathematics and archeology. "Religion", as you're selling it, would include guesswork, faith, best estimates, rough ideas, threats of retribution or reward in another life beyond this one and a mystical creation-grid on which to base the universe. It's the walking visualization of a lack of knowledge. You may as well believe the boogymonster is under your bed, too.

Big difference. Again, 1+1=2 because I can prove it. Can you prove the monster under your bed?

You're obviously very wound up about this topic, and your idea of a discussion is ranting like a child and calling me a third grader.

Absolutely the case. I feel extremely strongly about this topic. You want to follow a church state to its logical conclusion? Go send your girlfriend to live in Afghanistan for a while and let me know how awesome religious tyranny is for her.

And as far as ranting, let's see...

*****

"How about just doing away with religion in general? And make it all encompassing to boot?

I guarantee you, you make everybody in the world atheist through education, enlightenment and patience to disprove their religion (and it can be done with EVERY religion) and you'll see a new world order of peace, tolerance and understanding within the first twenty years which will surpass anything that has come before it in all of human history.

And I mean Christians, Catholics, Jews, Mormons, Muslims, Hindus, Buddists, Wiccans, EVERYTHING. "

*****

Pretty basic opinion. Self explanatory, non inflammatory statement of opinion on the subject. Framed as fact, sure, but I think it's a pretty logical statement to make based on the thousands of years of violence and bloodshed that have resulted from religious wars. Obviously the lack of an irritating agent would result in, oh, less irritation?

Now, what was your response? Something to the effect of

*****

"I'm pretty sure that's already been tried, and it didn't work out. Read a book, clown."



*****

Right?

You obviously wanted a fight, bitch. Now you got one. Taking the "higher ground" now? Knock yourself out, but next time bring a little more in the way of firepower cause buddy, you are SADLY coming up short. You've got a book of matches and I've got a fucking flamethrower.

You're free to believe in atheism as much as you like, and raise your kids however you like.

I do and they will be.

Once you start espousing government laws and education to convert others to your beliefs, you've become just another controlling fanatic that you hate so much.

There are no worse fanatics than religious fanatics. I haven't seen scientists arm themselves and embark on any holy jihads to spill the blood of the faithful in the streets until they convert to common sense. Doubt I ever will, either, although I can rest safe in the knowledge that there will CERTAINLY be more wars over religion before there are less. History has established that beyond all doubt, but please...feel free to argue it with me.

And, of course, let's remind folks here that I haven't espoused the advent of "government laws" - I've simply stated that laws enacted out of "faith" and religious practice in the field of government needs to cease as a matter of common sense and fairness to everybody. Education in science and history and the viewpoint of any bible as what it is, a source of historical fiction as proven by established precepts of science and archeology, is hardly a crime.

If scholastic education of established facts and provable scientific knowledge has become a crime, then I suppose the only alternative is to do away with that reasoning, or at the very least include all sorts of different theories about magic and mysticism and giants from beyond the stars waiting to spank you for all eternity if you sleep with a girl outside of marriage or masturbate too much.

Of course, had we NOT already had that for a few hundred years (I believe they were referred to as "The Dark Ages"), mankind would unquestionably be hundreds of years ahead where it is now in its knowledge and technology, global ecology wouldn't be a concern..who knows? Maybe we would have even colonized other planets at this point.

But hey, thank God that didn't happen.

If you have such a hard-on for converting people to your beliefs, start a website and go door-to-door just like all the other zealots have to. Leave the government out of it.

Leaving the government "out of it" is EXACTLY the point. Nice to see you finally get it.

They didn't, they did it with the stroke of a pen, using the "laws" you're advocating.

What laws? Oh, the laws enacting removal of religion from the government? Ahh, but I wasn't ever professing the enacting of laws into government, was I? How many times do you need that simple concept explained to you?

Never mind. You'll just default to it again.

In the Soviet Union and in China. The Soviets FAILED, for a number of reasons that are too extensive to get into.

LMAO

As of 2005, up to 48% of Russia declared itself either atheist, agnostic or just as a general non believer without any title. One of the guys I work with is even more militantly atheist than I am, and an activist, and he just got back from being stationed there. The numbers haven't declined much since then.

Nice try, though.

Adherents.com: Atheist Statistics | Agnostic

China is a FAILURE in progress, and they've already started letting people practice their religions in the open again.

Coerced atheism is falling in proportion with the failure of communism. Voluntary atheism is rising everywhere, and there's a difference. A forced belief structure is oppressive; I'm glad to see it go. The peasants of the country have lost their way of life with the decrease of forced communism - considering their status, of course new found religious freedom is going to be embraced. That's something any juvenile could see. Provided higher education becomes available to its HUGE peasant population which really has nothing to fall back on right now OTHER than religion due to the loss of communism as a way of life, well...in ten years, we'll see how that goes. People can UNlearn mysticism just as easily as they can learn it, so long as the proper tools are provided. It was all I needed.

Chinas levels of higher education are growing rapidly, though; once the numbers stabilize you'll be able to use that argument a little more effectively, should the numbers go your way and religion continues to grow AFTER higher education has taken on more of a presence. Of course, as with anything oppressed directly by any government, there will be an increase in it once oppression is lightened.

And your small-minded ideas: FAIL.

Haven't really made that case yet though, have ya?

They're just regurgitated shit from the one-sided sensationalist books you eat up.

Well, pray for me then. Maybe God will send a bolt of lightning down on my hand and send this poor, wayward sheep back to his flock...



And finally, since you're "leaving the discussion"...

So I'll leave the discussion with this:

Leaving the discussion is the smartest move you've made thus far. I commend you for it. You're at least sensible enough to know when you're completely outgunned, and for walking away, props. No bullshit.

[bueno bob]

[bueno bob]

By the love, I LOVED this part:

"Originally Posted by bueno bob:
What is aspired are seeing laws..."

(Note that you decided to cut my quote off at that point, COMPLETELY misrepresenting what I actually said in the process, but I guess post editing isn't entirely outside of your arsenal. Amateur, but educational about your game, or lack thereof as the case may be...)

To which you replied:

"Once you want laws enacted..."

LMAO

Of course, I never said ANYTHING about having "laws enacted". Had you posted my ENTIRE quote (without the "..." that conveniently benefited you), it would have went like this:

"What is aspired (to) are seeing laws and mindsets enacted solely from ancient myths removed from the governmental process all together."

Of course, you completely fucking misrepresented that point just to try and make YOUR off-base argument about my supposed desire to oppress the religious with laws against them drive home clearer. A point that, of course, has no basis in actuality except for in your own obviously uninspired imagination.

Pretty much a typical knee-jerk response from a religious person. Can't argue the point? Eliminate half the words and argue something else completely different out of it! Don't like what the bible says about something? Change the interpretation! Jesus corrected all that old testament stuff, right? Yeah! That's the ticket!

I see my estimation of your third grade mindset wasn't all that far off, was it?

Ladies and gentlemen, let's hear it for bueno bob...

[Nickdfresh]

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[ELVIS]

That may be the single worst post i've come across at this website...

[Satan]

I thought it was funny. And I'm actually IN the Bible!

[bueno bob]

That may be the single worst post i've come across at this website...

Unfortunately it's also an exceptionally accurate description. I know; I've read it.

Sorry.

[standin]

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The popular song "Prayer of the Children" is sung by thousands of choirs worldwide. This version features Bestor himself singing - along with Sam Cardon, Keni Yarbro, and Paul Engemann.

Music by Kurt Bestor
Produced by Brian Blosil.
Executive Producers: Randy Blosil and Bruce Bastian.
Innovators - Prayer of the Children

[ELVIS]

I've read it.

I kinda doubt that, but i'll be fair and take your word...

But if you did read it, you were either already biased, or God has prevented you from it's understanding. And if you indeed did read it, you would have found exactly what I just said...

[ELVIS]

let me expound on 'prevented.'


Psalm 69:23

New International Version
May their eyes be darkened so they cannot see, and their backs be bent forever.

New American Standard Bible
May their eyes grow dim so that they cannot see, And make their loins shake continually.

GOD'S WORD Translation
Let their vision become clouded so that they cannot see. Let their thighs continually shake.

King James Bible
Let their eyes be darkened, that they see not; and make their loins continually to shake.

American King James Version
Let their eyes be darkened, that they see not; and make their loins continually to shake.

American Standard Version
Let their eyes be darkened, so that they cannot see; And make their loins continually to shake.

Bible in Basic English
Let their eyes be blind so that they may not see; let their bodies for ever be shaking.

[Seshmeister]

Which parts of the warnings in Bob's picture do you think are untrue?

I don't understand your objection.

[bueno bob]

I kinda doubt that, but i'll be fair and take your word...

Thank you. I have, cover to cover, at least three or four times.

But if you did read it, you were either already biased, or God has prevented you from it's understanding. And if you indeed did read it, you would have found exactly what I just said...

Well, it's a book, at least several thousand years old, most of which was written through oral history passed down years after the facts in question took place. I stated that I look at it as "historical fiction", and I don't think it should be taken as anything more serious than that, frankly.

As soon as one element was proven inaccurate by science and/or archeology, the whole of it was called into question.

Of that warning sticker picture, all of those things warned about occur in the bible. Incest, violence and bloodshed, revenge, bigotry, human rights violations, lawlessness, contempt for authority...those things are all present in the old testament; in fact, that's practically the majority of the old testament.

I don't for a second believe that "God has blinded me" as to being able to correctly interpret the bible. Due to the fact that God is all love all the time and wants all hearts to be open to him so that they come to see him through Jesus Christ, blinding my eyes to the works written therein intentionally would mean that the plan is self-defeating. Unless he's bored and doing it to keep himself interested in the game, which IS possible; I suppose infinity would breed infinite boredom.

Still, logic dictates that I'm not the only one he'd put through that wringer, since it's written in the bible. I'd assume there's not a passage thereafter that says "This means you, Bob!". So in reality, are those the actions of a deity worthy of trust?

No.

The alternative is that those words were added by somebody who had a religious agenda to pursue and was (quite rightly) fearful of people who would read the words in that book and question their authenticity and accuracy.

"Well, uh...if they question it, then God has made them to question it because his plan is perfect and he's, uh, got a plan for them. Hellfire and damnation! Now let's go convert at the point of the sword!"

Which option do you think sounds more reasonable? More feasible?

Be honest.