The Fiscal Cliff talks: a framework emerges

[Satan]

Republican President/Messiah Ronald Reagan on the subject of cutting Social Security



There you go, Repukes.

Your Messiah says leave it alone.

[Nitro Express]

- President Eisenhower, November 8, 1954

People our age aren't going to see a dime of Social Security by the time we get old enough to collect it. In fact, who's going to retire? Nobody saves anything and even if you do, Ben Bernanke will ruin your savings. Right now the monetary system is against anyone who saves anything. They will just keep knocking the collection age up and play games until the system is truly broke by then the country will probably start coming apart anyways. The whole thing runs on some guy making money out of nothing and once that system gets away from reality which it has, you can't sustain it. In fact, it's been discovered the Federal Reserve has been moving trillions of dollars into foreign banks under the table and so there is a whole other economy we don't see. This keeps inflation for the little guy down and allows the elite to make lots of money but that can't go on forever.

So it still boils down to what that US Dollar will buy in the future and most people have no idea. I sure as hell wouldn't even buy 30 year US Treasury Bonds right now and a few years back, you never feared of doing so. That's how fucked things are. Shit. Your kid can't even make money in a passbook savings account. Now to teach the kid how to save you have to buy spot silver and hold it.

The world will have to go back onto a silver/gold standard or at least base a percentage of the currency on it. The big question is who will control this new money system. They probably are already fighting over that behind closed doors. Why Ben Bernanke is holding interest rates to zero is the Federal Reserve doesn't want to pay anyone nor does the US Government want to pay anyone. Then you systematically inflate the value of the currency to zero and get rid of all debts. People who hold the currency long-term will be ruined and then you just roll out a new currency and start the process over. Whoever holds the silver and gold in their bank vaults will win the biggest confidence. That's why silver is low right now. The banks are keeping the price low so they can buy more.

Nothing is going to get fixed. The situation is just going to continue to rot away and then those with the gold and best weaponry will take over. As long as the nuclear powers can keep a nuclear stalemate going, there will be relative piece but as soon as someone gets confident they have first strike capability they will use it. The only threats to us there are Russia and China but they may be big threats in ten more years. If they can hit the US first, then China will take Japan, Australia, Indonesia, New Zealand and other countries. Russia will blackmail Europe. I mean the big geopolitical picture really isn't money in the long-run, it's nuclear strike capability or any other weapon system that gives you a big edge. Who cares how much debt you get into why when you have the best weapons? I think this has been the US way of thinking for the last 50 years.

[Nitro Express]

It's pretty damn sorry this country kicks the can down the road each year. Anyone in business would love at least a five year tax plan. Taxes are one of the biggest expenses and when you don't really know what they are going to be year to year, you hold off on employing people and expanding the business. I know so many people that have some great ideas but they are just sitting in a holding pattern because they don't want to commit the money because they don't know what the future is going to be. Nobody knows what the costs on so many things are going to be and that uncertainty hurts business.

[Little Texan]

I don't understand what the point is in having a debt ceiling if it's just going to get raised every few months when we hit the debt limit?

[Nitro Express]

I don't understand what the point is in having a debt ceiling if it's just going to get raised every few months when we hit the debt limit?

It's just another sign that the corruption levels in government are so high that the whole system is spinning out of control. It's a failing government and failing governments become police states. Why do you think they passed the National Defense Authorization Act? Because citizens were starting to protest en mass in the streets. Notice after Obama signed the NDAA into law, the whole Occupy Wall Street protests suddenly stopped. The government intimidated the protesters to stop it.

Right now people are scared of the government and the government is scared of the people.

What's scary is it's pretty clear certain politicians want to start another major war. When Russia draws a line in Syria and says enough is enough, it means the free for all heyday in the middle east is over. The traditional way to get out of a big fiscal mess is to start a war as a distraction. In other words you create a bigger enemy so the public focuses on that instead of thinking you are the enemy. Well in a world of nuclear weapons and other high tech weapons that kind of thinking can be dangerous.

We don't even seem to have a unified government. It seems to be just a bunch of greedy people out for their piece of the pie and everyone has their own agenda pushing to see what they can get away with.

We were talking about Mitt Romney over Thanksgiving. Some of my family members know him. Basically he's a super motivated type individual and basically he is what we call a Mormon mainstreamer. What that means is a Mormon who has done well who wants to please the establishment or become part of the establishment. Mormons have always been an odd duck and some of them like Romney think being in the establishment will end the old stereotypes. The problem is the establishment is corrupt but a guy like Romney is blind to it. I mean the Bush family is not stupid. I think they knew they had a pretty good puppet and their agenda is to attack Iran. Mitt getting elected could very well have caused World War III.

Who's pulling Obama's chain has a different agenda. I think the Obama Administration has been secretly moving weapons from Libya to Syria. I never buy they are doing it to get rid of a dictator. The middle east has been ran by dictators forever. There is always another reason. Look at Egypt. They just got another dictator.

Basically a bunch of old oligarchs hijacked our country. They have bought both the Republican and Democrats parties and use our treasury and military for their own selfish purposes. One thing for sure, most our so-called elected officials don't serve the people anymore. They serve who has the money and influence. They serve the 1% and apparently the 1% have differing agendas or different plans. It's a mess and it's a mess worldwide.

[Nitro Express]

When the government can't put together a budget and cut wasteful spending and elections that cost billions of dollars change nothing, the country has already gone off the cliff. There is no middle class anymore. Half the country is out to lunch because they don't pay any income tax. Interest rates are held at zero percent. A lot of the so called solutions sound like they come right out of the communist manifesto. Nice times we live in. Another day in upper Hell.

[BigBadBrian]

There you go, Repukes.

Your Messiah says leave it alone.

That was then. Now there's like $5 coming into SS for every $7 paid out. Figure it out.

[Nitro Express]

I think we are heading into territory that many more people will see the whole Republican vs Democrat thing as the scam it is. In the 80's the banks and corporations were bought up. Viacom was used to buy up most the media. Then more and more politicians got bought off an intimidated. Over the decades the so called 1% got increasing more amounts of the US economy. Obviously the Bush's and Rockefellers were involved in this going way back to WWII. Then you had their Democrat agents like The Clintons pushing the agenda forward. People will soon see Obama is just another banking/corporate shill. It's just a bunch of corporate facist assholes stealing our money and taking our rights away. The sooner we get past this Republican and Democrat thing the better. Both have sold us out. The assholes who are taking over need as much infighting as possible and they will fan it as much as they can. What we need is a unified focus on the few oligarch assholes who have spent the last 50 years doing this shit to us.

[Satan]

That was then. Now there's like $5 coming into SS for every $7 paid out. Figure it out.

That's easy to fix. Raise the cap.

Republicans are always telling us that $200K/year isn't "rich". Yet not a single dollar goes to Social Security over $107K. This would be the easiest fix ever.

[FORD]

Lose Timmy the Keebler Elf, and hire this guy, Barry!

[BigBadBrian]

Obozo's latest offer is a joke: a butt-load of new taxes and a promise to reduce entitlements "next year." He's an ass.

[Nickdfresh]

Actually you mean repealing ostensibly temporary tax breaks for the top 2%. You won't notice...

[BigBadBrian]

Actually you mean repealing ostensibly temporary tax breaks for the top 2%. You won't notice...

Obama CLAIMS he wants both tax increases on the upper 2% AND cuts out of entitlements, so:

At this point, I think the Republicans should let Obama have his removal of tax breaks for the upper 2%. Then we'll watch him crap his pants trying to figure out whatever cuts he supposedly has in mind.

[FORD]

No crapping of pants is necessary.

Clinton left office with a surplus. Logically then, why not simply roll back the tax rates and spending to where it was then?

Of course, rolling back the Reagan tax "cuts" and HIS increases in wasteful "defense" spending would be even better.

[BigBadBrian]

wasteful "defense" spending would be even better.

What is wasteful about it? Name programs and policies you would cut.