South Dakota Closer to Outlawing Abortion

[Cathedral]

Originally posted by Nickdfresh
Well said...

I think it's just stupid when I hear about people in this forum complaining about schools showing teens how to put a condom on a cucumber, then in the same breath, decry abortion...

Strong words coming from a person who has no kids.

[FORD]

Originally posted by Cathedral

Schools aren't the one's who are to arm your children with the knowledge of how to be responsible, that's the job of the parent, but being "lenient" is not the way to do it.

And what happens when parents refuse to take that responsibility?

I'm sure I've mentioned this story in a previous abortion thread, but it's still a great example.....

This girl who lived up the street from me was from a Catholic family. Her mother physically pulled her off the school bus the Monday morning of the week where sex education was to be taught in school. Within a year, that girl was pregnant. She probably wasn't even 15 at the time. And she would have two more kids while still a teenager. Probably went on Welfare, if I remember correctly.

Obviously, her parents did not take the responsibility to educate their daughter. And they wouldn't allow the school to do so.

So the kid went on her own knowledge, or what her friends told her, which was probably something like "Oh you can't get pregnant the first time" (or whatever).

If the parents HAVE done their job, then I don't see what harm could come from a kid hearing the facts in school. If the parents have NOT done their job, it could make a world of difference.

[Nitro Express]

When I was a freshmen in college they came into our biology lab and showed us all the different kinds of birth control. I'll never forget some dude grabbing a canister of contraceptive foam and slipping it into the back pocket of some hot chick. She didn't notice and she went walking around campus with a canister of cotraceptive foam stuck to her hot ass. LOL!

[Nitro Express]

The bottom line is kids need to know that when the horny as hell boy shoots his love cream into the girl's holy of holies, things happen. It may be old fashioned but kids need to learn to keep the hormones in check; especially now with a huge list of venerial diseases. Even meningitus has been linked to kissing multiple partners.

There's just some dirty pussy, tongues, and asshole out there and the worst case scenerio is dying a slow agonizing death from AIDS. Genital warts and herpes don't sound fun either.

As far as condoms go. They suck. Nobody is going to use them the Planned Parenthood way either. Who wants to put spermicide in the girls pussy, wait 15 minutes, roll the condom on propperly and then fuck what feels like a rubber glove being stuck into some sloppy green Jello? Naw, we want bare tissue rubbing each other and blowing the kak all over the place. Having sex with a condom is like buying a Koler multiple head shower experience and wearing an industrial fishing raincoat and boots in it.

Naw, God wanted us to fuck natural and he created marriage to do it in. Anyone who goes against God will be tortured with the results of their own actions. What can I say. God is an asshole! LOL!

[Cathedral]

Originally posted by FORD
And what happens when parents refuse to take that responsibility?

I'm sure I've mentioned this story in a previous abortion thread, but it's still a great example.....

This girl who lived up the street from me was from a Catholic family. Her mother physically pulled her off the school bus the Monday morning of the week where sex education was to be taught in school. Within a year, that girl was pregnant. She probably wasn't even 15 at the time. And she would have two more kids while still a teenager. Probably went on Welfare, if I remember correctly.

Obviously, her parents did not take the responsibility to educate their daughter. And they wouldn't allow the school to do so.

So the kid went on her own knowledge, or what her friends told her, which was probably something like "Oh you can't get pregnant the first time" (or whatever).

If the parents HAVE done their job, then I don't see what harm could come from a kid hearing the facts in school. If the parents have NOT done their job, it could make a world of difference.

I'm not saying sex education is a bad thing. I had sex ed in health class my freshman year and it wasn't about condoning sex at all. it showed the reality of child birth, the consequences of engaging in a sexual relationship before your mind has had the chance to mature emotionally etc.
That is not the message being taught today, what is being taught today comes from the perspective of, "Well, since you're going to have sex anyway, here's how to do it", and that's such a crock.
It's basically saying, "We give up, so go forth and fornicate".

Society and it's liberal attitude that all things are proper from programming on tv, to billboards, to magazine ads, to whatever the eye can see or hear outside the home contributes to the problem.

Pardon me for saying this, but when our nation embraced some biblical principle's things like this weren't so rampant. that is not to say it didn't happen, but it was a rare occurance.

What needs to happen is that parents need to be educated on how to deal with these issues.
And in a worse case scenario, if a child gets knocked up by her boyfriend she shouldn't be allowed to discard the baby.
It's like saying, "Oh darn, you got pregnant, well we'll spare you learning the facts of life by taking that mean old baby out of you".

Give me abreak!

Look, instead of passing laws that make abortion legal we should pass laws that say, "If your daughter gets pregnant then that young mothers parents are legally responsible for raising it until the young mother is an adult".
I guarentee you that a change in how people think of their kids will change and that alone would take a chunk out of the number of abortions happening each year.

When a juvenile gets in trouble for damaging property the parents have to pay the damages. make that apply to teenage pregnancy and parents will step up to the plate and manage their kids far better than the average person does now.

That won't end abortion, but it is one of many things that can be done to reduce it.
And it still says nothing about the government having no right to give permission to anyone to kill a fetus.

The moment a seed produces a root it is considered a plant, same goes for the seed that produces a fetus.
Once the seed sprouts, you have life, period.

There are many ways to combat abortion and teen prgnancy, none of which are being explored or promoted by our government or liberal society.
I don't know how many Conservatives Politicians truly oppose abortion, but i know plenty of conservative voters that do with a vengance.

The starting point should be by placing the responsibility for how kids turn out on the parents who raise them until they reach the legal age of 18.
Parenting doesn't come with auto-pilot as an option.

[Nickdfresh]

Originally posted by Cathedral
Strong words coming from a person who has no kids.

Ahhh, the wonders of birth control...

[jhale667]

Originally posted by Cathedral
Strong words coming from a person who has no kids.

Strong and true. And sorry Cat, obviously your intentions are noble, but if you think your sitting down with your daughter's dude means he now wants to F*** the dogshit out of her any LESS, or won't try....well, you've forgotten what it was like to be a teenage boy.

[vheddyrmv8]

Originally posted by Cathedral
I agree with you on one point, it is the parents fault if their kid comes home pregnant.
The only kids that don't come home pregnant before they are married are the one's that were raised with some self respect.
The kids that can go to their parents about anything and everything without being judged.
The job of a parent isn't to just sit back and expect the kids to experiment with sex, drugs and alcohol, or be "lenient", as you suggest, that is the excuse a child will use to run around and be irresponsible.
No responsible parent is going to give them the tools to go running off into the world and dive right into things they are not emotionally ready for.

Sorry wrong word I don't mean for them to let kids run around and fuck but rathar not bug them constantly when they are at dances or things like that and aren't even doing anything.

That is society talking, and in a socialist atmosphere you make perfect sense.
Pregnancy is not the only risk involved with pre-marital sex, we're talking about STD's, HIV, and all out AID'S, you know, things that can actually kill you.
Any parent that is "lenient" as you suggest, and in that regard, is a worthless parent who doesn't really give a rats ass about the lives or futures of their children.
Parents and schools who think of sexual contact in a social sense are not teaching the kids what they should be teaching them.
Like how sex is something special between two "LOVING" and "MARRIED" people, not something to do on the weekends with someone you "like" a whole lot. it's a lack of responsibility, period.
My kids haven't and won't go running about screaming they weren't educated and hopping from bed to bed, I took care of that by being open and honest with them when they asked the tough questions. and why do i do that?
Because it is MY responsibility not to fumble the issue for their sake.

Yes STDs are even worse than pregnancy IMO and teaching kids about that is good as well...seeing graphic videos on what can happen will really ingrave it in someones head. And once again I didn't mean letting them do whatever they want, you sound like a great parent, but there are actually parents out there that abuse kids, i have friends that want to hurt themselves because their parents call them worthless pieces of shit and bitches all of the time...and yes those are their exact words. Acting like that will make a child seek attention from someone else...and where else but a boyfriend or girlfriend and they will do anything just to have a relationship to have someone that cares, thats another big one on the pregnancy statistics that people sometimes don't look into.

I respect your opinion, but you're only addressing one issue, teen pregnancy, and that tells me you are missing the most important points based on the social mindset that has been programmed into you.

Kids are lost because the parents allow them to take that first step in the wrong direction, it isn't about NOT being educated on safe sex practices, that is the excuse of a foolish parent/child relationship.

I respect your opinion as well...but i talk to kids every day that have sex all of the time, and after seeing these STD videos and getting contraception information has changed how they act, so I know that it works. Just telling kids to completely ignore it is foolish I would agree there. You can't just tell a drug addict to stop taking drugs, you need to help them and show them the immense consequenses of taking drugs.

Your parents apparently didn't spend much time on the subject with you because to them it was probably due to the common stigma most parents have that prevents them from doing so, and it's called embarrassment.

Yes my parents do that's how I have my opinion on how to stop teen sex. My mom had her first kid at 16 and when i got a girlfriend she hounded me constantly and it just made me want to do more with her. My mom has never had any embarassment talking about it.

When my oldest daughter started dating I sat her boy down and i told him about the values and the understanding i had with my daughter. I also told him what i expect from him when he is with my daughter and the consequences of violating any of that.
I didn't stand in the way of them growing up, but i made my children look for something long lasting and meaningful, not just short term and i certainly didn't hand the boy a pack of condoms and say, "Be Careful!"....That's rediculous, but it does happen in todays liberal society and any boy who enters my childs life thinking like that is easy to spot, all you have to do is watch how he looks at your daughter when her back is turned to him.
You can literally see the saliva run down their chins, and i'm dead serious.

Yes I agree that is rediculous...but tell me what is more rediculous? Giving your child a box of condoms because most animals on the plannet cant control the urge to reproduce, it isn't any different with humans, especially with hormones raging during the teenage years, or your kids finding ways to have unprotected sex behind your back (which is a lot easier than most parents recognize)? I think, as a caring parent which you seem to be since you are so strong on the issue, that you would rathar take the first route. Now not all kids are doing it, that would be crazy, but a lot of kids are. If you got a bunch of kids in a room, a lot would say they have lost their virginity at around 14 or 15 which is surprising. Now tell me what is wrong with making sure your kids don't have sex...but also protecting them at the same time?

Schools aren't the one's who are to arm your children with the knowledge of how to be responsible, that's the job of the parent, but being "lenient" is not the way to do it.
If a kid steps off into the wrong direction they need to be corrected, they need to be educated (at home) by people who have experience in the area.
And i don't just mean saying, "Don't do this" and then walk away, I man sitting down with them and explaining all the good points and bad points of what a sexual relationship involves.

I would disagree that it's not the schools job...school's purpose is to prepare kids for life..all parts of life, not just math and science. Most parents don't know a lot of this information about stds or contraception, since a lot of it wasn't known when they were kids. Most teachers are parents too so why wouldn't they be fit to teach them? I agree they shouldn't be the only ones, you are right that parents need to educate just as much as schools do.

And another thing, the trust to be able to have these discussions begins when they are exposed to sex, which due to society and what they see on television is getting younger and younger every day.
with my oldest she asked me about sex when she was 12...my youngest began asking about it at 9.
The point is, a parent who ignores what they are taking in and fails to address will result in them trying to gain this mutual respect and trust when the "curiosity" as you put it has already set in, and 9 times out of 10 they'll end up giving their innocence to the wrong person.

I 100% agree.

And another thing, those who aren't a parent don't have any right telling me anything about being one because they don't have a clue what they are talking about at all.
They would be better served keeping their mouths closed until they can speak from experience and not some socialistic viewpoint where anything and everything goes.
I did my job and i'm still doing it today and let me tell you, my kids know what is right and what is wrong and if they don't they have no problems coming to me for any reason.
And that is only because I didn't just turn them loose for their heads to be filled with moral value I don't respect.

True I don't have any right. But parents don't have any right to claim to know what really happens with kids these days since they aren't kids. It goes both ways. I wasn't in any way making this out to be directly at you or anyone else here. I am giving the kids' point of view. How can you stop this issue if you don't listen to the people in question?

Next, you'll be telling me that by sticking my nose into their business i am invading their privacy, right ?

Well, I'd agree with you because until they reach 18 years of age and move out on their own they are legally MY responsibility and they do NOTHING i am not aware of.
but again, My relationship with my daughters was never about keeping secrets and doing things behind my back, it was about mutual respect for one another.

No I'm not giving parenting classes, I have no plans to be a parent anytime soon, and I certainly have no right to preach about it. Parents should be wondering what their kids are doing. But invading everything in their life is no better than the government listening to everyone's phone conversations or emails. The thing called the mind...how parent's act towards their children will determine how it grows. If you raid your kids room every day, ask a ton of questions about where they are and what they are doing every day, you can leave a big emotional toll and then have a kid who is always insecure. Now before you go and say "oh you're saying I'm ruining my kid's mind?" No, I'm not, none of this was directed at anyone here in the first place, only at the parents I know.

I lost my oldest in car a crash a few years ago, but before and since then i have seen all but one of her friends give birth before they graduated high school. the thing that makes me break down and weep is when the one who didn't get pregnant told me she was sad for the one's that became parents and that she followed Tabitha's lead when everyone else was bedding down...and she knew it was because of how open our relationship was...she told me it was because MY daughter gave more thought to her future than she did having sex with her boyfriend.
At her funeral this kid told me she wishes she had a Father like me, and it broke my heart, but filled me with pride that i had done my job right....because i really didn't know until that moment that i was successful.

I am very sorry to hear that, that is a terrible thing to happen, I couldn't evenb begin to imagine the pain that you have gone through. But once again, I'm not directing this at you. You seem to be a great parent, and if this isn't happening to your kids for sure, then you have nothing to worry about.

My daughter had too much respect for me to risk ruining her life and destroying all possibility of becoming any of the many things i knew she could be in life and what she wanted to be.
I support my children with everything i have inside me. I never took my attention and focus off of their lives for any reason and i damn sure never used "leniency" in raising them, and i never will in the remaining 8 years i have left to raise my baby.

You have a great daughter then, and since you do it would be hard for you to believe, but most kids don't. Some kids never learn respect for anyone, and that's how we end up with people like Joe Thunder, a lot of kids haven't developed it by that time, a lot of kids just go with their feelings without thinking of the reprecussions.

[EAT MY ASSHOLE]

Originally posted by Nickdfresh


when I hear about people in this forum complaining about schools showing teens how to put a condom on a cucumber,

I bet that turns you on, doesn't it?

Fag.

[Nickdfresh]

Yeah, but at least you don't need birth cuntrol when asking guys to 'eat out your asshole'...

I bet your little sister gets a coat hanger every once in a while though, after your father bangs her...

On the bright side, you can't get your nephew pregnant...

[Cathedral]

Originally posted by jhale667
Strong and true. And sorry Cat, obviously your intentions are noble, but if you think your sitting down with your daughter's dude means he now wants to F*** the dogshit out of her any LESS, or won't try....well, you've forgotten what it was like to be a teenage boy.

LOL, I think i'm a bit smarter than that.
I will admit that i have been lucky because my first child had good taste and great judgement in who she chose to date.
And my knowing exactly how I was at their age is a great tool i use to my advantage.

Hey, I know what my dates parents said to me didn't matter once i got her out the door. most of the time it was the girls who initiated things anyway.

And therein lies the key...I am doing my best to ensure my daughter remains in control of herself and acts responsibly. I can't see the future of course, but i have faith in my Li' Pumpkin not to become a whore.
Both my daughters are very different, and i'll admit that my baby girl is a little bit more like me than her sister was...and that aspect does give me concern as she gets older.

Believe me, I don't claim to be Super Dad or anything like that, but i'm not one to take chances with my kids future.

And say she does make the mistake and falls for the crap boys always lay down....Abortion will never be an answer, and she WILL finish school and go to college if i have to raise the child myself until she gets her degree.

[Cathedral]

Originally posted by vheddyrmv8
Sorry wrong word I don't mean for them to let kids run around and fuck but rathar not bug them constantly when they are at dances or things like that and aren't even doing anything.





Yes STDs are even worse than pregnancy IMO and teaching kids about that is good as well...seeing graphic videos on what can happen will really ingrave it in someones head. And once again I didn't mean letting them do whatever they want, you sound like a great parent, but there are actually parents out there that abuse kids, i have friends that want to hurt themselves because their parents call them worthless pieces of shit and bitches all of the time...and yes those are their exact words. Acting like that will make a child seek attention from someone else...and where else but a boyfriend or girlfriend and they will do anything just to have a relationship to have someone that cares, thats another big one on the pregnancy statistics that people sometimes don't look into.



I respect your opinion as well...but i talk to kids every day that have sex all of the time, and after seeing these STD videos and getting contraception information has changed how they act, so I know that it works. Just telling kids to completely ignore it is foolish I would agree there. You can't just tell a drug addict to stop taking drugs, you need to help them and show them the immense consequenses of taking drugs.



Yes my parents do that's how I have my opinion on how to stop teen sex. My mom had her first kid at 16 and when i got a girlfriend she hounded me constantly and it just made me want to do more with her. My mom has never had any embarassment talking about it.



Yes I agree that is rediculous...but tell me what is more rediculous? Giving your child a box of condoms because most animals on the plannet cant control the urge to reproduce, it isn't any different with humans, especially with hormones raging during the teenage years, or your kids finding ways to have unprotected sex behind your back (which is a lot easier than most parents recognize)? I think, as a caring parent which you seem to be since you are so strong on the issue, that you would rathar take the first route. Now not all kids are doing it, that would be crazy, but a lot of kids are. If you got a bunch of kids in a room, a lot would say they have lost their virginity at around 14 or 15 which is surprising. Now tell me what is wrong with making sure your kids don't have sex...but also protecting them at the same time?




I would disagree that it's not the schools job...school's purpose is to prepare kids for life..all parts of life, not just math and science. Most parents don't know a lot of this information about stds or contraception, since a lot of it wasn't known when they were kids. Most teachers are parents too so why wouldn't they be fit to teach them? I agree they shouldn't be the only ones, you are right that parents need to educate just as much as schools do.



I 100% agree.




True I don't have any right. But parents don't have any right to claim to know what really happens with kids these days since they aren't kids. It goes both ways. I wasn't in any way making this out to be directly at you or anyone else here. I am giving the kids' point of view. How can you stop this issue if you don't listen to the people in question?



No I'm not giving parenting classes, I have no plans to be a parent anytime soon, and I certainly have no right to preach about it. Parents should be wondering what their kids are doing. But invading everything in their life is no better than the government listening to everyone's phone conversations or emails. The thing called the mind...how parent's act towards their children will determine how it grows. If you raid your kids room every day, ask a ton of questions about where they are and what they are doing every day, you can leave a big emotional toll and then have a kid who is always insecure. Now before you go and say "oh you're saying I'm ruining my kid's mind?" No, I'm not, none of this was directed at anyone here in the first place, only at the parents I know.




I am very sorry to hear that, that is a terrible thing to happen, I couldn't evenb begin to imagine the pain that you have gone through. But once again, I'm not directing this at you. You seem to be a great parent, and if this isn't happening to your kids for sure, then you have nothing to worry about.



You have a great daughter then, and since you do it would be hard for you to believe, but most kids don't. Some kids never learn respect for anyone, and that's how we end up with people like Joe Thunder, a lot of kids haven't developed it by that time, a lot of kids just go with their feelings without thinking of the reprecussions.

You have made some extremely valid points, and i appreciate your understanding of my post. I did not take your initial comments personally of course, but i do understand that what goes on in my home isn't practiced in all homes.
I wish all parents would do right by their kids, but you're right, a hell of a lot of them just don't care and never will.

I'd like to think I had all the answers, but I just don't, not for anyone but my children and the lives i am responsible for.

My downfall is my passion for children to be treated fairly and with unconditional love by those who should care the most.

I just believe with all my heart that things could be better if they hadn't been allowed to decline for so long.
I do kind of see the entire situation as hopeless, but deep down inside me i can't accept that and will always feel as strongly about it.

But hey, we have to start somewhere and i believe there are better alternatives to what we have in the works now.

Great post by the way, I didn't mean to imply that your parents failed you in any way since i can clearly see by your posts they did a pretty good job...whether we agree or not.